HIV patients told by Pentecostal pastors 'to rely on God'

[Edwardo Piet]

I have a vibrator like that.

Has it been dusted for drich's fingerprints?

Chuck, stay the Fuck, out of my fantasy.

[Nine]

Chuck, stay the Fuck, out of my fantasy.

Well at this point there's the story of a dildo flying through space towards Andromeda. It can't get much better than that.

[NoraBrimstone]

... "indivisual"

[Cyberman]

That's the term for when one person sees something nobody else does.

[NoraBrimstone]

That's the term for when one person sees something nobody else does.

Right. Like right before a seizure and I see bugs nobody else can see?

[Esquilax]

That's because my 'healing' wasn't for any of you. It was for me. It was my wake up call it was my alarm bell and it was the catylist for me to change my direction in life.

I even said this in my orginal post, that I asked God to help me change my life whatever the cost. My 'health' was the price. Once I accepted the price God refunded the cost.

God generally works with one person at a time on an indivisual level. For all others who see the help an indivisual get, God can be dismissed. (Thus ensuring they too have to make the same choice the person getting the Help had to make.) But, for the one who received the help, there is no doubt. For the indivisual that is all the 'proof' they need.

Maybe for your "indivisual" self that's good enough, but all that shows is that you have ridiculously low standards for evidence. But you've got no right to be claiming that any of this is even approaching factual with that kind of nonsense. One wonders why you even brought it up, if it wasn't for us, anyway.

---

Well at this point there's the story of a dildo flying through space towards Andromeda. It can't get much better than that.

Sure as fuck beats out the celestial teapot story.

[Drich]

it called google chuckie. you can find as little or as much as you want the point og me posting that article was to show you the information is out there if you want to find it.

It's called critical thinking skills and source research. It's what is meant to stop people from snatching up any passing straw that stinks of bullshit and then regurgitating it and passing that off as filet mignon.

Oh, Stimmy. You didn't actually do a google search did you? It's almost like I was setting you up to fail again.

I showed you a possiablity of the information being out there, made mention to it, even gave you a place and a subject line to start checking for your self (to do all of the things you were just preaching to me about Statler) and you did none of these things. Rather you simple relied on the idea that I would approach you with my best argument first. (Which is a common westerner failing.) and assumed that I fit the ignorant lying about my healing Christian sterio type you and others like you have conjoured up through discussions amongst yourselves.

In the east it is a very common practice to test the waters first before fully engaging in a conflict to allow one's opponent to reveal their complete position. Then flank and attack or in this case point out your own failings.

Here's what a page one google search yielded on the subject matter.
http://www.aidsmeds.com/articles/hiv_con...entson=yes

Taken from the above link:
VISCONTI participants initiated ARV therapy within ten weeks of becoming infected with HIV and remained on treatment for roughly three years. They averaged 500 CD4 cells and viral loads of 100,000 copies upon starting treatment. Roughly six-and-a-half years after stopping treatment, the average CD4 cell count was 900 and all study subjects had viral loads below 50 copies.

"Six years after interruption of treatment, patients treated early on in the post-infection period present a perfect ability to control the HIV infection,” Bacchus said. She added that VISCONTI cohort participants also possess an extremely small reservoir of HIV in CD4 cells, similar to levels seen in “elite controllers” who spontaneously reduce their viral loads to undetectable levels without treatment.

I bring this article from AIDSmeds, to point out the term "Elite Controllers."

This is an article on 'HIV Controllers' http://www.hivcontrollers.org/hivcontrollers

..And for the final nail, here is one on 'Elite controllers' in the Oxford journal.
http://cid.oxfordjournals.org/content/51/2/239.full

Again I oversimplified my position, but in the end it still rings true. People who have been healed of HIV have been either labled a liar as you people did. or in the medical community have pointed to a weaker strain of HIV. (Which btw is counter to the whole evolution thing, but who cares so long as no one has to officially acknoweledge God.)

Now I did not say and frame all of that to just personally berate or make fun of you (Even though I did take a great amount of pleasure in it )I said all of those things to prove this point.

Look at all of the time and research I have done and put into my orginal argument. and then compare it to what (not just you personally) but the rest of you said, thought and how you reacted. What was it based on?

From my factual position it looked like "you people" had this collective mob mentality about what AIDS is and is not. It seems to be based on a 20 year old understanding of the disease, that none of you were willing to challenge even though there was plenty of proof out there...

That should make you wonder about other 'doctrines' you hold to be absolutely true in your life simply because your 'peers' also think the way you do... Good thing you all did not live in the days before Columbus proved to Europe that the Earth was not Flat. Or you'd be on that bandwagon as well.

Point? If your wrong about something with well documented proof behind it, how do you know your not wrong about God as well?

---

That's because my 'healing' wasn't for any of you. It was for me. It was my wake up call it was my alarm bell and it was the catylist for me to change my direction in life.

I even said this in my orginal post, that I asked God to help me change my life whatever the cost. My 'health' was the price. Once I accepted the price God refunded the cost.

God generally works with one person at a time on an indivisual level. For all others who see the help an indivisual get, God can be dismissed. (Thus ensuring they too have to make the same choice the person getting the Help had to make.) But, for the one who received the help, there is no doubt. For the indivisual that is all the 'proof' they need.

Maybe for your "indivisual" self that's good enough, but all that shows is that you have ridiculously low standards for evidence. But you've got no right to be claiming that any of this is even approaching factual with that kind of nonsense. One wonders why you even brought it up, if it wasn't for us, anyway.

---

Well at this point there's the story of a dildo flying through space towards Andromeda. It can't get much better than that.

Sure as fuck beats out the celestial teapot story.

To point out to you that if you simply A/S/K you Too can be plagued with an incurable disease or put into some other no win situation, to give you the same opportunity I had. To accepted your fate and and accept God's will as your own, allowing you (and whatever time you have left) a personal knowledge of God.

[Esquilax]

To point out to you that if you simply A/S/K you Too can be plagued with an incurable disease or put into some other no win situation, to give you the same opportunity I had. To accepted your fate and and accept God's will as your own, allowing you (and whatever time you have left) a personal knowledge of God.

You know, you've been pimping this A/S/K shit for almost as long as I've been here. When will you figure out that, to us rational types, it is an insufficient process to justify belief in anything, even if one were to do it and become convinced?

Again I oversimplified my position, but in the end it still rings true. People who have been healed of HIV have been either labled a liar as you people did. or in the medical community have pointed to a weaker strain of HIV. (Which btw is counter to the whole evolution thing, but who cares so long as no one has to officially acknoweledge God.)

Would you care to explain why this is contrary to evolutionary theory? And why you opted to employ a false dichotomy, namely evolution or god, with nothing in between?

Oh, and by the way, you still haven't demonstrated that god was involved at all, so... hey.

[pineapplebunnybounce]

I don't know why you're attaching god to a few articles.

Spontaneous remission happens in almost every condition there is. Some progress slower than others there are actually explanations for that. It's called genetics. The article you linked from oxford just describes the phenomenon and they're studying how to replicate it in others. There's actually a guy out there who's immuned from HIV. you want to claim god did it as well? You can claim all you like, since your god seems to only take credit for the things you like and not the ones you don't.

I'm just surprised why you think anyone would believe you.

[justin]

hehe god give people HIV's and then he wants a serious relationship based on faith and he'll heal his victim. What a douche!!
Mom: "Timmy god loves you so much he created you in his own image and made you unique"
Timmy: "You mean HIV's and all? *crying* God has HIV's? why couldn't he just leave that out! i bet mary gave it to him!"