Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: December 12, 2024, 10:10 pm

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
New Athiest Needs Help
#21
RE: New Athiest Needs Help
There's no scientific answer to the question.
Reply
#22
RE: New Athiest Needs Help
(June 1, 2014 at 10:48 pm)Lek Wrote: There's no scientific answer to the question.

There's no 'definite' answer to the question, but there are certaintily scientific hypothesis that hold more weight than others. I just started reading A Universe from Nothing by Dr Krauss (thanks, ThePinisir!), but for right now I'll quote Wyrd of Gawd
Quote: The problem is that it's almost impossible to to imagine what true "Nothing" is and what its properties are. That's because we live in a sea of "Something". However, it should be obvious that "Nothing" really exists and that it is the source of Everything. We should know that because the visible building block of the Universe is hydrogen, which evolves from "Nothing". Once "Nothing" creates hydrogen all things become possible. The hydrogen clumps together into giant balls and then ignites in a nuclear reaction to form stars, which create the heavy elements and real material.

We may not have the definite answer, but to assume "God did it!" is the most dishonest answer there is for this question. The truth is these 3 words, that most Christians hate "We Don't Know" and that's fine.
Reply
#23
RE: New Athiest Needs Help
(May 29, 2014 at 3:54 pm)OhWord Wrote: I read this I know it's Bull But Could you refute it?
Thanks.

If you know science there is no such thing as infinite... If I have an infinite number of Dollars and I subtract 5 is there still an inifite amount or is it infinite minus 5?

Astronomers and Cosmologists agree that the universe has a beginning and is not infinite in size.. As Aristotle said the infinite is potentialized never actualized

So since we have established that there is no such thing as infinite that means the universe had a beginning there are 4 logical answers for the beginning of the universe seen and unseen;

1) the universe was created via nothing
2) the universe created itself
3) the universe was created by something which was also created
4) the universe was created by something UNCREATED

The universe cannot be created via nothing because the definition of nothing means zip zero not an atom nothing.. Your mother cannot give birth to herself... Number 3 if the universe was created by something which was created than you are implying the universe seen and unseen has an infinite past and a logical fallacy and if you believe that you ignore science... That would mean the created creator would have had a created creator which would have had a created creator and so on... We know that infinite is an impossibility so there would have had to be an Originator... The One who begets not nor is begotten

Wouldn't the same logic that tells us the universe began and cannot be infinite also tell us that an infinite creator (or uncreated creator) is not possible?
You can't say the universe must have a start point or cause, and then turn around and say there could be some sort of creator that exists and has always existed outside of space and time. If an uncreated creator were possible, wouldn't an uncreated infinite universe be just as possible?
(August 21, 2017 at 11:31 pm)KevinM1 Wrote: "I'm not a troll"
Religious Views: He gay

0/10

Hammy Wrote:and we also have a sheep on our bed underneath as well
Reply
#24
RE: New Athiest Needs Help
(June 2, 2014 at 11:51 pm)OhWord Wrote:
(June 1, 2014 at 10:48 pm)Lek Wrote: There's no scientific answer to the question.

There's no 'definite' answer to the question, but there are certaintily scientific hypothesis that hold more weight than others. I just started reading A Universe from Nothing by Dr Krauss (thanks, ThePinisir!), but for right now I'll quote Wyrd of Gawd
Quote: The problem is that it's almost impossible to to imagine what true "Nothing" is and what its properties are. That's because we live in a sea of "Something". However, it should be obvious that "Nothing" really exists and that it is the source of Everything. We should know that because the visible building block of the Universe is hydrogen, which evolves from "Nothing". Once "Nothing" creates hydrogen all things become possible. The hydrogen clumps together into giant balls and then ignites in a nuclear reaction to form stars, which create the heavy elements and real material.

We may not have the definite answer, but to assume "God did it!" is the most dishonest answer there is for this question. The truth is these 3 words, that most Christians hate "We Don't Know" and that's fine.
I don't hate those three words at all. Hypotheses are just that. You said in your introduction that science explains our origins. Does it?

(June 3, 2014 at 12:08 am)Losty Wrote: Wouldn't the same logic that tells us the universe began and cannot be infinite also tell us that an infinite creator (or uncreated creator) is not possible?
You can't say the universe must have a start point or cause, and then turn around and say there could be some sort of creator that exists and has always existed outside of space and time. If an uncreated creator were possible, wouldn't an uncreated infinite universe be just as possible?

Yes. But it would have a supernatural explanation, not a natural one.
Reply
#25
RE: New Athiest Needs Help
(May 29, 2014 at 4:34 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote:
(May 29, 2014 at 3:54 pm)OhWord Wrote: If you know science there is no such thing as infinite... If I have an infinite number of Dollars and I subtract 5 is there still an inifite amount or is it infinite minus 5?

How many points in a line between your eye and your finger?

Zero. Ow!
Reply
#26
RE: New Athiest Needs Help
(June 3, 2014 at 10:34 pm)Lek Wrote:
(June 3, 2014 at 12:08 am)Losty Wrote: Wouldn't the same logic that tells us the universe began and cannot be infinite also tell us that an infinite creator (or uncreated creator) is not possible?
You can't say the universe must have a start point or cause, and then turn around and say there could be some sort of creator that exists and has always existed outside of space and time. If an uncreated creator were possible, wouldn't an uncreated infinite universe be just as possible?

Yes. But it would have a supernatural explanation, not a natural one.

Why does that matter? And how do you know?
(August 21, 2017 at 11:31 pm)KevinM1 Wrote: "I'm not a troll"
Religious Views: He gay

0/10

Hammy Wrote:and we also have a sheep on our bed underneath as well
Reply
#27
RE: New Athiest Needs Help
(June 3, 2014 at 10:34 pm)Lek Wrote:
(June 3, 2014 at 12:08 am)Losty Wrote: Wouldn't the same logic that tells us the universe began and cannot be infinite also tell us that an infinite creator (or uncreated creator) is not possible?
You can't say the universe must have a start point or cause, and then turn around and say there could be some sort of creator that exists and has always existed outside of space and time. If an uncreated creator were possible, wouldn't an uncreated infinite universe be just as possible?

Yes. But it would have a supernatural explanation, not a natural one.

Feel free to call it "supernatural" all you want. The point was that if an uncreated God is possible, then so should an uncreated universe.
Reply
#28
RE: New Athiest Needs Help
(May 29, 2014 at 5:43 pm)Beccs Wrote:
(May 29, 2014 at 4:09 pm)Esquilax Wrote:


Ignore what I said! ^^^^^THIS^^^^^



Mmhm. That mans mind makes me want to lick things.
If I were to create self aware beings knowing fully what they would do in their lifetimes, I sure wouldn't create a HELL for the majority of them to live in infinitely! That's not Love, that's sadistic. Therefore a truly loving god does not exist!

Quote:The sin is against an infinite being (God) unforgiven infinitely, therefore the punishment is infinite.

Dead wrong.  The actions of a finite being measured against an infinite one are infinitesimal and therefore merit infinitesimal punishment.

Quote:Some people deserve hell.

I say again:  No exceptions.  Punishment should be equal to the crime, not in excess of it.  As soon as the punishment is greater than the crime, the punisher is in the wrong.

[Image: tumblr_n1j4lmACk61qchtw3o1_500.gif]
Reply
#29
RE: New Athiest Needs Help
(June 4, 2014 at 12:45 am)Luckie Wrote: Mmhm. That mans mind makes me want to lick things.

Don't get saucy in the debate threads hon, it's distracting! Wink

Heh, and Losty already asked the question I was gonna ask Lek, so... Angel
"YOU take the hard look in the mirror. You are everything that is wrong with this world. The only thing important to you, is you." - ronedee

Want to see more of my writing? Check out my (safe for work!) site, Unprotected Sects!
Reply
#30
RE: New Athiest Needs Help
(June 4, 2014 at 1:37 am)Esquilax Wrote:
(June 4, 2014 at 12:45 am)Luckie Wrote: Mmhm. That mans mind makes me want to lick things.

Don't get saucy in the debate threads hon, it's distracting! Wink

Heh, and Losty already asked the question I was gonna ask Lek, so... Angel

But...but...saucy Luckie is my favorite style of Luckie Sad


Haha you're a good teacher and I was paying attention :p
(August 21, 2017 at 11:31 pm)KevinM1 Wrote: "I'm not a troll"
Religious Views: He gay

0/10

Hammy Wrote:and we also have a sheep on our bed underneath as well
Reply



Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  The Devil just needs a character rewrite Nachos_of_Nurgle 16 2045 February 16, 2022 at 12:47 am
Last Post: Paleophyte
  Why does god put the needs of the few above the need of the many? Greatest I am 69 7435 February 19, 2021 at 10:30 am
Last Post: Fake Messiah
  This Movie Needs A Guy and Two Robots Making Fun Of It Minimalist 7 1770 June 7, 2016 at 10:46 pm
Last Post: Rev. Rye
  10 Questions Every Christian Needs To Answer. Whateverist 63 15905 August 6, 2014 at 2:55 pm
Last Post: Mister Agenda
  Fairly new and hoping for advice and help potch 21 3245 May 19, 2014 at 10:48 am
Last Post: Clueless Morgan
  I'm sorry this needs to be said themonkeyman 41 11331 November 18, 2013 at 5:00 am
Last Post: Esquilax



Users browsing this thread: 8 Guest(s)