RE: "Free Will" Belief/Disbelief Poll
November 4, 2010 at 9:06 pm
(This post was last modified: November 4, 2010 at 9:16 pm by jason56.)
(October 27, 2010 at 7:11 pm)jason56 Wrote: I think the only debate going on here is to define the meaning of "free" and "will".
Quote:I consider freedom to be what can be done, and would dispute the use of it in most cases I see. Will has a number of uses, which include his being my cook, bodyguard, doctor, dentist, and good friend. How do you describe the two?
Yes, but two people will never paint the same picture of an event.
Quote:They're human concepts and therefore don't exist outside of the human mind.
Quote:Yet... that which can be known by your own "human mind" is the only existence you can know. Unfortunately, I see many a solipsist take that to mean 'nothing can be known' or be considered 'real'.
You can take some things as red purely because it aids us to do so, but it's still for our own amusement. If the human mind was rendered "stupid" by a "higher" life form then... we're just pigs in shit arguing over a carrot.
Quote:It's like arguing with a mathematician that infinity doesn't exist.
Quote:It does... and so do Gandalf and Dumbledoor. Why would you think otherwise?
Infinity is another example of man defeating man. We invented the concept of numbers to use as a tool, but we end up with infinity as a by-product of our imperfect labelling of the universe.
Quote:We're not going to prove the concept of free will without defining our own arguments.
Quote:Isn't that what they were sorta... doing?
Yeah, you've got me there.
Quote:And even then, it doesn't matter if your will is technically free or not, you'll still look up at the Sun and thank the lord for another day in paradise.
Like every animal.
Quote:You know... it really doesn't matter. Why not? Because we couldn't detect the difference between our actions being determined by who we are in the situation... and us acting in a situation based on who we are.
And I've yet to see a chihuahua express gratitude. The damn rodents just YIPYIPYIPYIPYIP, even if I'm being the nicest person I know how to be. Give them a treat? YIPYIPYIPYIPYIP! Give them a toy? YIPYIPYIPYIPYIP! Give them a shock collar? YIP-bzt-YIP-bzt-YIP-bzt-YIP!!!!
Damn things cannot be pleased, that is my conclusion. I can only try to shut them up or remove them from the vicinity (making their barks less annoying).
Oh, and I don't express my gratitude for existing to the sun, or any gods, or aliens. Rather, sometimes (rarely) I wish that it/they would magically fix some things for me. But I stopped holding out on that idea some years ago now. Doesn't mean I don't wish it would happen... it's just not feasible as I see it.
Oh, and sponges also don't seem very good at expressing gratitude. Yeah yeah... tell me "dead things can't express gratitude!"... it should fucking consider itself lucky that I didn't use it for the toilet. It's buddy is considerably less so.
Just because we're the most "intelligent" animal doesn't actually guarantee any of the ideas we come up with. There is no more benefit to being a human being passing on your genes than a rat. Only the rat doesn't burden itself with the concept of free will, it would probably be out having sex right now... and not posting "shit" on a forum.
It's all about perspective, baby.
