Why the "There are so many interpretations of the Bible" claim is confused

[TheRocketSurgeon]

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TheRocketSurgeon


I am hoping that I've not done all this work in vain, I went through every verse you posted and answered each one, this all took more time than I thought it would and I've been busy getting my home and property ready for winter. Please don't do like all the others when I post this much in answer to your post, they will ignore all the work I put into it to give them an answer, childish is all I know to say of them. Sorry this took so long, but here it is.

 
There are no word games, what I'm saying is from scripture and you know this if you've studied scripture as you say you have. There's no threat either and you know this also if you are the scholar of the scriptures you say you are. As we have discussed, we are born with a sin nature meaning we are going to sin and man himself created this situation not God. This being so means we are bound for an eternal punishment, unless we find a way out of it. God provided a gift, His Son, to save us from this eternal punishment, this is justice and a gift from God. Please do not come back with a robber threatening someone with their lives, it's old and tiring. The person being threatened in that analogy wasn't in that situation from birth and might not have ever been, it took a decision from someone else to put them in a threatened situation.


Of coarse I know what happens at death, why ask such a silly question. I didn't say God wasn't hidden anymore, so it's not my story, it's what you want others to believe I said, when I did not. God's not hidden from anyone who wants to accept Christ as their Savior, all one needs to do is sincerely seek Him and they will find Him, come to know Him and trust Him. For those who claim God has hidden himself they are trying only to fool themselves so they want have to accept He's real. I have looked at my beliefs about God sincerely and honestly and because I have God has revealed himself to me in ways that gives me personally proof of His existence, not doubts at all. So yes I can reject all others because I know the One True God and He says there are no other gods.



Your condescending statement is not appreciated. Because I believe differently than you doesn't mean either of us is superior to the other. Yes I do believe in the Creation story and the story of the fall, if you believe this makes me something less than you then your mind is smaller than you believe.


I didn't say we are born with sin stain, that's you twisting what I actually said, (sin nature) there's a big difference. Again if you were the scholar of the Bible you claim to be you would know it says we are punished only for our own sin, not others. I did say we are to try and abstain from sin, I also said it was impossible for us because our nature is to sin. Christ was given as a sacrifice to redeem us from our sin, and He is our gift if we decide to accept Him. This is the only way to salvation, you can't earn it as you have suggested in your previous post.


That was a nice story, very enjoyable and did suggest salvation through a sacrifice, how ever C.S. Lewis said he did not write the story as a reflection upon the Christ story.


Salvation can not be earned, you claiming to know the scriptures should know this. Paul teaches this throughout his writings and Jesus himself said that no one can come to the Father except by me. Neither claimed that one must earn salvation, if we could then Christ's death on the cross would not have been necessary. Once someone accepts Christ as their savior then they have a desire to live a life according to His teachings and many of those teachings came from the OT.



Never will I stop using the word free when I speak of salvation. It's only considered a lie by those who run from God, it makes them feel like God doesn't exist, however no matter how you want to look at it you can't wish the living God away.


That's right and that's what scriptures teach.


I don't have to tell you there's a debt to be paid, you know there is, it's the guilt that's being suppressed in your heart that creeps out on occasion to haunt you. You make the debt, why do you think you don't believe you need to repay it. You try that with a bank and you end up in trouble, right, same with God.


You are grasping at straws now or you're showing ignorance of the Bible. We do not have to pay a price for Adam and Eve's sin, the Bible is explicit about this, that's straw one broken. There was no magical necessity, it was a purposeful necessity, either that or hell for the sins we commit.
God murdering you, what kind of thinking is that, IMO it's absolutely ridiculous. Christ's blood has paid for all, if you do not accept the payment then you will not receive the gift. How is it someone as smart as you can't see the truth God presents through the Bible.



They didn't believe Christ was for the world as you have so crudely said, they believed wrongly that Christ was their personal possession, the whole of the Bible teaches that Christ came to save the world.


I didn't say sin was more powerful than God, He will destroy sin forever once it runs it's coarse. Sin is chaos and has no rules, sin goes against who God is, talk about lies, you've thrown out several so far, an intelligent person shouldn't have to resort to such tactics. What child's play tells me, you have found or developed a hate for God to benefit your desires, you have fallen short of His will for your life and put your own self in jeopardy of eternal punishment.



It's your right to have opinions about me, that doesn't mean you're correct though. I have told you before I've considered what I believe through the study of the Bible, very involved study. I find God none of what you claim, actually I find Him loving, truthful, just, responsible, caring and always ready to help even before I know I need help.



You're right, sorry I miss read what you said.


I didn't say we haven't done good things and you know I wasn't advocating such. As for prisoners well we have gone overboard and need to back off on somethings, but that's a discussion for another thread. The depravity I see is such as child porn and slavery, there are more children and women in slavery today than any time in the past. Homosexual marriage, people living together instead of marrying and making a commitment to each other, divorce at an all time high, kids killing each other and teachers, a country wealthy enough to feed all it's own people and many across the world yet greed keeps it from happening, I could write much more but I believe you see what I'm saying.



I been here for over five years and seen all the things said about Dawkins and he has been raised on a very high pedestal, so much so it seems many revere him as a god, don't tell me I haven't seen this when I know I have, why are you defending those who are wrong, it doesn't look good. I do not care what you've read, I've seen Dawkins making his grand stands when he is at different schools, he's as arrogant as they come.



Deut. 13:7-19 These verses were for Israelis to punish Israelis, God wanted to keep corruption from false gods out of the people from which He would bring His Son. You left out verse 6 and part of verse 7 that states that this is meant only for disobedient, covenant breaking Israelis, they made a covenant with God not to worship false gods.

Deut. 17:2-5 These verses are also for Israelis against covenant breaking Israelis, again this pertains to the covenant they made with God not to worship false gods. You also left out the verses following verse 7 that says, you are to have two or three witnesses against the covenant breaker, one will not do. The witnesses are to cast the first stone the the rest of the village is to cast stones, this you left out was to prevent an injustice being committed against an innocent person.

Exodus 22:19 God wanted to protect His people who were chosen to bring His Son into the world from perversions and sexual immoralities, this type of perversion would be dangerous on many levels, one would be to protect the people from sexual diseases. 


Lev. 20:10-16 I've added verses here, these verses show how much God hates sexual impurity and wants to save His chosen people from something that could destroy them, also this is a way of transmitting sexual diseases, they had no cure for them then, sexual purity was the only sure preventative.

Deut. 22:20-21 Again God hates sexual immorality and if the daughter disgraces her father by an act of sexual immorality she is put to death. This is to protect the family name and more so the name of Israel before the nations around them. You also left out the verses preceding verse 20, they are about the man accusing a fathers daughter of not being a virgin because the man hates her or whatever the accusation may be. If the daughter was a virgin then the man must pay the father and remain the daughters husband for the rest of their lives. God wants His people to live honest and just lives to honor Him before the other nations.


Deut. 13:15 You've already brought this up, it was the very first one but I want to add something I left out in my earlier answer. God said the people had to be certain that men of a town lead the town astray to worship false gods. He also said to destroy the people and the town and everything in it, they were not allowed to keep anything from that town, it was to all be burnt. God wanted to keep His people pure to keep out the corruption of false gods because this was the people chosen to bring His Son into the world.

Deut. 18:20-22 Again you're leaving out verses relative to the ones you posted. This is a prophecy in itself about the Son of God and that the people shall know this prophet by his truths, truths from the Father. Then God says that the false prophet or prophet from a false god is lying to them and they should not be afraid of him because what he says can bring no fear to them. God also says that prophet shall die, He gives no command for him to be killed nor does He say how the false prophet will die.

Zech. 13:3 Verse 1 is about the second coming of the Messiah, this is prophecy, God the Father is saying He will cleans the earth and there will be no use for prophets again. God says if any man prophecies during this time he is a liar and his father and mother will tell him he will not live for what he has done and will pierce him through. God is cleaning up the world and will not allow such things to go on to corrupt others.

Lev. 24:10-16 Once again this is law for Israelis against Israelis, they are a chosen people (actually a nation made by God) for the purpose of bring into the world God's Son. God asked for respect from this people and they made a covenant with God not to do these things you complain about, things that apply to only the Israelis, why because they know Him personally.

Ezekiel 9:1-7 This is a prophecy, a vision given Ezekiel by God, this is what God shows Ezekiel will happen when the Persian Empire puts Jerusalem under siege. God shows Ezekiel that the unrighteous will die and God will save the ones He sees as righteous for a remnant to preserve Israel. To put it simply, God was showing Ezekiel what was going to happen to Israel by the Persians and that He would save a righteous remnant of Israelis to preserve the nation. If you had wanted to know what was actually happening in that chapter, you would have read the chapter after chapter 9 and discovered God told Ezekiel what would happen to other nations when the Persians came rolling through.

Exodus 31:12-15  Keeping the Sabbath in these verses was given specifically to the Israelis, nothing to do with the NFL, or any other sport played on any day. Since Christ we have worshiped on Sundays they were worshiping on the last day of the week, so tell me which is the seventh day, by the calendar Saturday is, we worship a God who is eternal and keeps no real calendar. To answer your concern, God wanted His people to be holy as He is holy and keep His commandments to show the world who He is and to have a good nation to bring His Son into the world, this is a day intended for God and His people to have fellowship in a more personal way.


Lev. 25:44-46 Since you seem to pick verses out of the middle of several verses meant for an understanding of what God wants for His people, I'm having to show how what you're doing here is wrong. The beginning of this teaching starts at Lev. 25:35 and this teaching is about how Israelis are to treat each other. They are not to take advantage of those Israelis who are down in life, they are to help each other without taking advantage of them in any way. This is also how the teaching ends in Lev. 25:46. The verses you have pulled from the teaching is to show how the Israelis are to treat each other in contrast to how the world treats other people and even their own people. God gave them permission to have slaves from other nations for many reasons, but I believe the one that's foremost here, is that before the nation of Israel was ever established the world was using slaves everywhere. God was working through the history of man. Nevertheless the teaching here is how Israelis are to help each other.

Exodus 21:20-21 In these verses God calls for the slave owner to be punished if the slave dies, if the slave lives the slave owner is not to be punished. This continues in Exodus 21:26 if that same slave suffers the loss of an eye or tooth the slave is to be freed, seems to me God didn't want slaves mistreated. In Exodus 21:21 the word translated survives literally means stands, which to mean would actually indicate the slave lives. I know you will take it as you desire but the possibility is there that the slave lives.

Deut. 22:28-29 Surely you know your ancient history well enough to know that a young woman was only worth to the family what would be given for her by the groom's family. If she is raped then she will become a burden to the family, she becomes someone to take care of without any means of contributing to the finances of the family. This is why this law is given among others, the family is financially satisfied and the woman gets her husband that has to take care of her for the rest of his life, this was set up as a deterrent to rape, a man might think twice about raping a women he doesn't desire to spend the rest of his life with. Unfortunately men held women in low regard then and didn't consider what they might think of the man who raped her, though she knew that he was the only one she could marry, because no other man would want her, not in that day.


In Numbers 31, God was taking vengeance on the Midians and He used the Israelis to do so, God is cleaning out the land for His people, this isn't murder it's war, the same kind of war many nations waged against Israel (which you do not complain about, strange). The women who were keep were children, still virgins and nothing was said in those verses that the men could rape them, there were penalties for that behavior.
In Deut. 20:10 The Israelis were to ask for a peaceful resolution first, if the peoples agree then the people of that city became forced labor, this was a standard of wars during those days. Again there is no mention of the women being used for rape or sexual slavery (if you actually see a difference in the two).
Judges 5:28-31 This is part of a song sang to the LORD, the verses you posted said nothing about sexual slavery nor rape, sure you know the scriptures as you profess.
Zech. 14:1-2 This is a continuation of the prophecy in chapter 13, this is yet to come. The ravished women in this verse are those that the nations warring against Jerusalem will ravage, this isn't anything God is commanding, it is what He sees happening in the future it is those who are against God will do. You have given a poor account of yourself as one who claims to b the best Bible scholar on this forum. What did you really do Google this stuff up, were you just being lazy. I would expect someone who knew the scriptures as well as you've claimed would have taken in all the relevant verses before and after the verses you posted, were you even thinking when you posted this stuff.



I wrote off their ideologies, not the people and you know that's what I said, now how's playing word games. I haven't philosophies that condemn people for their race or thoughts. I have very specific beliefs about how and why people treat those they do not like ie. hate. Are you telling us you're a White Supremacist, if you're not why are you spending so much time with them, is the bold by me above a way of trying to hide the fact.


Now I see your problem when you say you were a Christian, you hated others and you had to because you said you were freed from it by your atheism. Christians are not to hate anyone, we can hate the sin but not the person, we are not to hate those of different religions, different beliefs or non-beliefs. We are not to judge others until we examine ourselves and then only by what the scriptures say and our judgement is never to be condemning. Yes Christians make mistakes and do things we shouldn't just like others do, but it seems as a christian you were doing everything Christ said not to do, no wonder you weren't happy as a Christian, you were living a life outside of what Christ called us to live, maybe you should try again and this time doing it with the love of Christ, the real love for mankind, a love that was given to save people from a destination the couldn't otherwise escape.


I've been in the home of the Grand Wizard of the KKK and I understand exactly what goes on with their twisted ideologies, for one killing people because their different is hate period. Hatred and murder have no place in Christianity, a definite teaching of Christ and His disciples.
I think you can't find a difference in how you conducted yourself as a Christian and what you see in them, I see this as a very sad thing, especially for someone with your intelligence.




I thought you were saying I was submissive.



I wasn't insulting you, I was pointing out that changing morals do not have to always be a good thing for people and at times they are not. If you really followed the teachings of Jesus you would see we do not need to change morals.


I guess will have to agree to disagree on this, guess you haven't seen all the post where I take a stern stand against depriving blacks or any other race for any reason, it's just plain wrong. I don't support any of the other stuff you posted either.





You forget I've had real experiences with God, He has revealed himself to me in ways that give me no doubts He's real.


I used "spiritual knowledge" because it means knowing for sure, spiritual discernment is knowing the differences of spiritual truths and the false things people call spiritual. The way you tried to use those verses you posted doesn't speak to highly of spiritual knowledge on your part, you showed how little you know about the scriptures. I'm not trying to say anything bad about you, I'm saying spiritual knowledge come from God, giving us the ability to understand His word and purposes.


When I say self interest I mean you think your way is right and that God doesn't mean anything to you, in other words you put yourself above the God of creation and salvation. It's the same thing Eve did when she listened to the serpent in the garden and then chose herself over God.


I don't need your forgiveness unless I've offended you purposely which I don't think I have. I have full confidence in my beliefs, I know God is real, no doubts, none at all, that's why I seek His forgiveness daily, I know I offend Him, the holy, righteous God of salvation.
Don't fell like you need to answer this post I know we've stretched this thing out, sorry it took so long to answer, I wanted to make sure I answered all of it and I've been tied up with things around here.

GC

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Well, well. Someone took a "big boy" poop...

Anyone willing to wade though this should have their head examined...

Without a doubt, my friend. Without a doubt.