(November 25, 2015 at 10:17 am)Drich Wrote:(November 24, 2015 at 6:39 pm)Chad32 Wrote: Other religions don't say that everyone can talk to god. That's only an issue if christians can prove that they're able to talk to god. Which they can't. You can find a lot of people claiming to talk to the same guy, yet are willing to kill each other over what that god is supposedly saying.
I meant a place, thing, or idea can't want anything. If he's not a person, then I'm not going to worship it. That's why I'm not a pantheist or something.
I don't see much difference between worship someone you can't prove exists, and claiming to. Either way you're folllowing what someone tells you, or what someone wrote in a book.
Yes evil people will do evil things regardless of religion. That wasn't what I meant when I talked about people bettering themselves, and you know that. I was showing that most of your examples are bunk anyway, because they're examples of dictators and religious extremists. It's not a very good point.
Killing an immortal being is a finite crime because it's a finite action. Spending a limited amount of time doing anything wrong is still a finite crime. Executing someone who does, or giving them life imprisonment would still be finite, unless he's immortal. Imprisoning an immortal being for eternity, or torturing them for eternity would be evil. Given eternity, you will eventually make up for wrongdoing. We don't imprison people depending on the estimated life someone might have had if they hadn't been killed.
I thought you were implying that we don't have free will. I believe we do. Though I also believe Yahweh has a very warped sense of morality which makes the idea of "sin" a moot point.
Actually they can.(provide proof) or rather you could if you were Christian. do you have examples of this? Before you say muslims ask yourself or maybe google a muslim prayer. Again they are not talking to God nor do they expect to get any instruction back from him that is not in their book/from a prophet the religion recognizes. You are assuming all religions teach the same thing. Again Christianity is very unique in it's claims, why? because a religion will not last as long as Christianity has making the claims that it does if it does not deliver.
Those claims being deliverable in this life and not the next like all other 'religions.' That means the vast majority of believers have made good/collected on the promises offered. In other religions people are content in simply living in faith that the next life will be rewarded.
you did not address the entire premise. why? does your point not stand when viewed through the lenses of all the conditions I placed on the situation?
We don't have free will. for instance if I wanted to stop sinning with all the will I possessed I couldn't. We are all slaves to sin. (among other things) Meaning our will is not free to do as we please (plus if you google the philosophy of free will their are a lot of compelling arguments (secular arguments) that disprove the idea of freewill as well. In any case as a slave we have been given choices to make. And like the slave (who's will is limited by his master) who has been given a few choices to make, we too will be held accountable to the decisions we make.
Just because you do not have totally free will, it does not mean you haven't been given choice. that is where the philosophy of 'free will' fails, and probably why it is not a biblical precept, but rather the bible tells us we are all slaves.
Christians can't prove they're talking to god, and he's talking back. If they could, we wouldn't be debating this thousands of years after he supposedly started talking to people. Whether prayer works or not is a testable claim, and it has failed. This is why some people say that god can do anything that also has some natural cause, but nothing that doesn't. Cancer goes into remission, and people come back from comas if their brain is still in one piece, but limbs don't regrow themselves.
I may have missed something, and need to reread. Can you repeat that part?
The only reason we can't stop sinning if we want to is because the one who claims we're sinning has set the bar impossibly high. If someone puts you in a hole too big to jump out of, and tells you you can leave as soon as you jump out, it's not your fault that you can't do it. Whether we have free will or not, I'm not too worried about my choices in life. If the guy upstairs wants to be stupid enough to believe looking at someone with lust is the same as adultery, I can't help it. Just don't be angry at me for not being able to control my thoughts.
Poe's Law: "Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is impossible to create a parody of Fundamentalism that SOMEONE won't mistake for the real thing."
10 Christ-like figures that predate Jesus. Link shortened to Chris ate Jesus for some reason...
http://listverse.com/2009/04/13/10-chris...ate-jesus/
Good video to watch, if you want to know how common the Jesus story really is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88GTUXvp-50
A list of biblical contradictions from the infallible word of Yahweh.
http://infidels.org/library/modern/jim_m...tions.html
10 Christ-like figures that predate Jesus. Link shortened to Chris ate Jesus for some reason...
http://listverse.com/2009/04/13/10-chris...ate-jesus/
Good video to watch, if you want to know how common the Jesus story really is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88GTUXvp-50
A list of biblical contradictions from the infallible word of Yahweh.
http://infidels.org/library/modern/jim_m...tions.html