RE: How are Dark Mtter and Consciousness different from Spirit?
February 9, 2016 at 8:42 pm
(This post was last modified: February 9, 2016 at 9:13 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(February 9, 2016 at 7:48 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: I think you're on crack. If you don't see any difference between what we see in the brain and consciousness, then you're not looking very hard.Okay, and I appreciate your opinion... but it wasn't something that mattered to me or my summary....so thats probably why, for the very last time, I accepted your comments from the outset for the purpose of discussion. Call it indirect evidence, call it insufficient evidence, it is still evidence, which is more than we have for soul. Call it an incomplete explanation, call it interpretation, that is still more than we have for soul - which is merely the claim absent of either explanation or interpretation.
Quote:You keep claiming that this metabolism is a better explanation, but I don't see any actual explaining. Just repetition of the same vapid claim. At present, both spirit and the brain explain consciousness equally well, which is to say poorly. Any supposed discrediting of the one hypothesis by the other is solely a product of your imagination. But enlighten me. How does the brain explain consciousness?Yes, I keep making the claim that metabolism is a better explanation -for the observation of an animating force- than spirits or soul. Because it is. I can't say I agree with you on the relative status of brain and soul/spirit as they relate to the question of consciousness. We have an idea of how the brain works, and how that fits into the consciousness question. I do not have an idea how spirit/soul works and how it fits the question of consciousness - if soul/spirit even exist to begin with (not a question when it comes to brain, eh)...until you (or someone, anyone) provide me with one. There does not seem, to me, to be the sort of parity you've claimed between them, however poorly you think brain is as an explanation...no one has done the work for soul that's been done for brain, and there is at least no open question of it's very existence. Open to me, mind you, closed to you, by presupposition...apparently.
I think that spirit/soul consciousness is misattribution, same as spirit/soul animating force was, and on top of that it's just as bankrupt as it's -ever- been as an hypothetical explanation for -x-. A placeholder for nothing. This, to my mind, discredits -any- hypothetical.
@ Rhonda Plenty of atheists either believe in spirit or would accept it as a hypothetical explanation. Buddhists and dualists, and even material monists for the purposes of discussion, for example. Exploring spirit, for me, has left me with the opinion that as it's used, -fundamentally-, it's a running argument from ignorance. Nothing more....regardless of any gods or even the existence of spirit. Or, to put it another way, it's no more involved in metabolism (or, imo, consciousness) if it does exist than it is if it doesn't.
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