(April 28, 2011 at 1:28 pm)Watson Wrote: Neither omnipotence nor being maximally good are trumped by the other. No one said God can't commit evil. He created it, He is capable of anything. That is the key difference between man and God.This is a bare assertion fallacy. You have no basis to assert a god always chooses good.
Romans 3:23
"for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
God chooses good over bad every time. Humans don't always choose good over bad.
It is interesting that you concede god is capable of committing evil. This is not my understanding of xtian theism, but it does mean he is not perfectly free to act. The xtian god is set to be perfectly free, and therefore this god as described does not exist.
If god is choosing, this implies that god takes into account events as they unfold, computes a response and then reacts. If this is true god also cannot be immutable (unchanging), another charactersitic of the xtian god. Surely if god exists he is indeed eternal and unchanging and has already decided before time itself existed?
Quote:We possess the knowledge of good and evil, just like God Himself. We are absolutely free to choose good over evil, any time, just the same as God...but we don't. We fall short of His grace.Its not the point I made, but I'll assume I made it badly. The point here is that god could have given us both freedom and only allowed us to choose to do good things, if you also beleive god is both free to act and is also maximally good. As you do not believe god is free to act, then this point is no longer relevant.
Quote:I don't claim to know God's reasoning for choosing good, I just accept and Im grateful for it. I thank Him for it. I trust that His choices are higher than mine and that He makes them out of love and compassion. He is not forced in any way.This is the bare assertion again. You do not know god chooses good, you beleive it for an unspecified reason (presumabley based on personal experience?). As pointed out there is no need to thank a god who has or can only ever choose to do good. Its like thanking a riveting machine for riveting; what choice is there for either god or the riveting machine.
Quote:I can't tell you that God isn't evil because I don't know, but from what I have seen and experienced, there is a God and He is working towards our benefit.Personal experience is not a strong argument for the existence of a god, and specifically a particular god. But we agree that god could be evil and the chances could be as high as 50% (assuming he exists).
Quote:You just committed the same fallacy you agreed with me has been made before. This is a non-sequitur argument with no basis for connecting the two arguments.I disagree there is a strong argument that at least the xtian god does not exist based on the above charcterstics. The argument would go something like this:
1. if the xtian god exists he is perfectly free to act, maximally good and omnipotent
2. any perfectly free being choose to perform an evil act
3. a maxmially good being can only ever choose/decide/elect to do good acts
4. an ominpotent being can do anything which isn't intrinsically logically impossible
5. thus the xtian god is either incapable of performing evil acts and is not free or is not omnipotent or is not maximally good
4. thus the xtian god does not exist
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"I still say a church steeple with a lightning rod on top shows a lack of confidence"...Doug McLeod.
