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Foundation of all Axioms the Axioms of Consciousness
#61
RE: Foundation of all Axioms the Axioms of Consciousness
(September 20, 2016 at 12:29 am)fdesilva Wrote:
(September 19, 2016 at 11:25 am)Jörmungandr Wrote: The real answer is to ask "Which image?"  There's an image in Germany, where the tv cameras are getting their image from the live event.  There's an image at each step along the way to your brain, otherwise the final image in your brain would be incomplete.  All of this is referring to an image or representation as being a real thing.  Is there really an image in the brain, or is it more a collection of memory registers each holding the various properties of the visual stimulus hitting the receptors in the eyes?  When I look straight ahead, there should be a hole where the blind spot is.  Does our brain "fill in" the hole, or does it simply not represent it?  You can't "see" what isn't there.  Regardless, the image in our head is not a one for one copy of the light hitting the retina; it is a constructed experience which only represents in the sense that a cake recipe 'represents' a finished cake.  It is more a description of what is being seen than an actual image of what is being seen.

To Rhythm and Jörmungandr
The image of interest is the image seen when a person say they see something. That is the image of the conscious experience.  So my answer to both of the above questions is C  or in the brain.
Everything we ever see ultimately is a construct of the brain. Now the axioms are about that construct.  Please note the axiom is not saying anything about where this experience is taking place. We know that from what we know about eyes and brains etc.
As far as the axiom goes it is equally applicable if the person is hallucinating a football match , tree etc or they are watching it as a real thing.
Jormungandr  from what you have written would I be right is say you agree with this view?


There is an ambiguity about how you use the word 'see' here, but if you tell me the construct in the brain which represents the image to the experiencer is the one you are interested in, I see no cause for disagreement. How that interacts with your 'axioms' is something I don't know, as I don't recall your OP very well. It seemed to me you lumped some disparate things together.



(August 19, 2016 at 9:00 pm)fdesilva Wrote: Axioms of I
1.Ability to observe U
2.Feelings
3.Free will
4.Curiosity and playful behaviour

I'm not sure how you are using the word axiom here, but 3 and 4 seem far from axiomatic. Even 1 and 2 are highly complex phenomena.

(August 19, 2016 at 9:00 pm)fdesilva Wrote: Axioms resulting from the interaction between U and I

Based on the type of interaction with I, U can be broken down into the following 3 Components.
1.Those which can evoke feelings in I (e.g vision) referred to as Sensory objects.
2.Those whose motion can be controlled by the Free will of I (e.g hand) referred to as Motor objects
3.Those which are model of past Sensory objects and Motor objects (e.g Memory) referred to as Memory objects

I think I see where you're going with this, but so far you've yet to take it anywhere.
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RE: Foundation of all Axioms the Axioms of Consciousness - by Angrboda - September 20, 2016 at 4:31 am

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