On Moral Authorities

[robvalue]

Erm... you said sexual abuse will always be immoral, and so god can't say it's moral. That's telling God how to run shit.

The problem, of course, is when theists try to say morality is about wellbeing and what God wants. If these two happen to be the same, then God is entirely irrelevant. If they differ, God poisons morality.

Erm... Sexual Abuse will always be immoral, for it is against God's will which is unchanging. So, it is based from God and not based from people.

It is not true that if well being and God's will are the same, then God is entirely irrelevant, for we can argue soundly that the source of well being is God. So, if there's no God, then there's no well being. But, there is God, per sound theistic arguments like the Five Ways of St. Thomas Aquinas. To deny the conclusions in Five Ways that God exists is to both deny things which are evident, (for the Five Ways starts with the things that are evident), and to deny laws of logic (for the Five Ways utilized valid logical forms).

But who is telling us what is god's will? You are. So if God turned up and said that actually his will is that sexual abuse is moral, what would you do then?

Is he allowed to speak for himself? Because you're far from the only person telling us what god's will is, and when you guys disagree, at least one of you is just making it up.

My position is a lot clearer. God turns up and says "Having sex against someone's will is moral". I'd say, "Please explain how that is". If he had no argument to persuade me, then I'd dismiss him. I don't take moral judgements from anyone. It seems unlikely there is any such argument to be had, but I'm always open to discussion.

What would you say to him? If an atheist can entertain a hypothetical, surely you can.