RE: What is your problem with Islam? Think about it
May 28, 2018 at 7:36 am
(This post was last modified: May 28, 2018 at 7:38 am by Fake Messiah.)
(May 27, 2018 at 8:13 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote: Yes. That's true. Taking non-believers as allies is a disaster, they rarely take Muslims seriously, and frankly they use the weaknesses of Islamic populations in a very obvious ways. If you want historical examples I can list them to you; but the last of them was what the British Empire did to its Muslim allies after WW1, which led to the nightmare of Israel.
The examples are many. Trump and his raids on Arab oil money is another. Taking non-believers as allies ends up with a knife in the back and a nuclear missile aimed to your head, and evil dictators from your own kin taking support from non-believers to shoot you down and rob your cash.
The examples are also many: Assad attacks Muslim children with chemo but get Russia to cover for him, the Sauds butchering their people but get American support -and their crown prince gets to meet the queen of England-, and so on.
Oh well so they are allies with Muslims but "wrong" kind of Muslims - fundies. But if you want examples there is a Muslim country like Bosnia where they are sort of liberal Muslims who are allies with Christians that live around and it's not a disaster.
But of course there is a question are fundie bloodthirsty Muslims more representative of Quranic Islam than liberal Muslims? You say that fundies are "butchering their people" but in many places Quran commands that same thing, like corporal punishment is promoted in the Quran. Sura 5:38 says, "As to the thief, male or female, cut off his or her hands."
Or Sura 24:2-4 says, "The woman and the man guilty of adultery or fornication are to be flogged with a hundred stripes: let not compassion move you in their case."
(May 27, 2018 at 8:13 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote: So it was a battle. And God was telling the believers -and Mohammed- to deliver a good fight, but if the disbelievers at Mecca stop, then Muslims should also stop.
Yeah, only if disbelievers accept Allah because sura 4:91 says, "You will find others who wish to obtain security from you and [to] obtain security from their people. Every time they are returned to [the influence of] disbelief, they fall back into it. So if they do not withdraw from you or offer you peace or restrain their hands, then seize them and kill them wherever you overtake them. And those - We have made for you against them a clear authorization."
It's very paranoid toward unbelievers sura 4:101, which says, "For the Unbelievers are unto you open enemies ... The unbelievers wish ... to assault you in a single rush."
It doesn't seem that Quran is telling Muslims to stop because in many places it tell them to kill, kill, kill
Sura 9:36 says, "Fight the pagans";
sura, 33:61 says, "Wherever they are found, they shall be seized and slain without mercy";
sura 9:5 says, "Fight and slay the Pagans wherever you find them and seize them."
sura 4:89, "They but wish you would reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing as they .... But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever you find them."
Or what about this Sura that tells Muslims not to take Jews and Christians as friends
5:51 "Take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors: They are but friends and protectors of each other."
I mean are you being good Quran abiding Muslims and not having Jews and Christians as your friends? Not only does this passage display a contempt for Jews and Christians but an appalling ignorance of historical events. All too often Jews and Christians have barely been able to stomach one another's presence.
(May 27, 2018 at 8:13 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote: Yes. God is furious with Jews. Even Jews themselves say that; didn't he cast them into the exile??
Indeed Quran is very antisemitic like Sura 26:55-58 says, "These Israelites are but a small band .... So we expelled them from gardens, springs, treasures, and every kind of honorable position." This intolerance resembles the Christian treatment of the Jews thought history.
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"