Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: July 23, 2025, 11:20 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Choosing to/not to Believe? Not Possible?
#20
RE: Choosing to/not to Believe? Not Possible?
(June 26, 2018 at 10:24 pm)JairCrawford Wrote: Now this is very interesting to me because I have heard this argument from certain Christian denominations before (namely Calvinism, which I am not of that camp) but from the inverse idea that one cannot choose to believe God because only God can choose us.

This is indeed something that Calvinists believe. Calvinists agree with the rules of the game as formulated by John Calvin, a theologian, not coincidentally, trained as a lawyer who preached that only a small minority of people go to Heaven and those "elect" were chosen by God before they were born, before the beginning of time, so nothing anybody did in life could change his or her probably hellbound trajectory.

And that does have basis in the Bible because some parts of it say that humans indeed don't have free will in this and everybody is already predestined, like

Romans 8:29-30
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate.... Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Ephesians 1:4-5
He hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will.

2 Timothy 1:9
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began.
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
Reply



Messages In This Thread
RE: Choosing to/not to Believe? Not Possible? - by AFTT47 - June 26, 2018 at 10:46 pm
RE: Choosing to/not to Believe? Not Possible? - by AFTT47 - June 26, 2018 at 11:42 pm
RE: Choosing to/not to Believe? Not Possible? - by AFTT47 - June 26, 2018 at 11:55 pm
RE: Choosing to/not to Believe? Not Possible? - by Fake Messiah - June 27, 2018 at 6:12 am
RE: Choosing to/not to Believe? Not Possible? - by brewer - June 28, 2018 at 10:57 am

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Why do you not believe in the concept of a God? johndoe122931 110 15080 June 19, 2021 at 12:21 pm
Last Post: Mermaid
  "Why is it reasonable to believe in prisons, but not in the hell?" FlatAssembler 124 14346 February 19, 2021 at 12:11 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Who do not atheists believe? Interaktive 12 3351 March 25, 2019 at 10:46 am
Last Post: Mister Agenda
  Possible girlfriend?? Manowar 30 6990 July 26, 2018 at 6:05 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  AronRa as blunt as possible. ignoramus 7 2131 April 12, 2018 at 12:38 am
Last Post: Amarok
  Sam Harris (an atheist) says that God is possible/inevitable ThoughtCurvature 12 3869 September 5, 2017 at 5:27 am
Last Post: Edwardo Piet
  What The Hell Do People Believe In If They Don't Believe In God? MountainsWinAgain 36 11241 May 30, 2014 at 3:22 am
Last Post: Rampant.A.I.
Smile Is Unbelief Possible? Hezekiah 154 28205 March 23, 2014 at 1:41 pm
Last Post: Belev2Know
  is it possible for me to one day be a skeptic? leodeo 12 4357 February 21, 2014 at 12:25 pm
Last Post: Simon Moon
  A scientific reason to not believe? journeyinghowie 60 31967 December 5, 2012 at 7:48 am
Last Post: Fidel_Castronaut



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)