RE: Silly Atheists.
October 9, 2018 at 12:37 am
(This post was last modified: October 9, 2018 at 12:45 am by pocaracas.)
Don't you just love it when your brain wakes you up 2 hours before you should wake up?
It gives us time to answer these things, even from the crappy touch keyboard on the phone, with its insufferable autocorrect!
Yes, I've heard your arguments.
No, I haven't found them convincing in the least.
Your arguments always fail to account for actual history and the well known human psychology.
How many times have I/we shown you that the burden has not been met?
You systematically ignore that.
We present you with the names of the fallacies you employ in the hopes that you will, at least, visit the Wikipedia page on those and see if they fit for yourself.
You have not once shown that you have done so.
Instead you keep arguing and slipping down into the same fallacies.
One gets tired of this ignorance parade... (I'm only replying now because I have some two extra hours to waste, courtesy of my non-sleeping brain... Otherwise, I wouldn't even bother)
That definition of God is flawed.
There is a woman I love which is the most important being. By your definition, she is god... Well goddess. And you're right, a bit. She does deserve all the praise, all the admiration, all the reference, all the dedication that you devote to whatever thing it is you mean by "god".
Why do you bring scriptures into this?
Scriptures are man-made books. And most scriptures have a well known time of writing attached. Considering all the history of mankind, and how belief in any sort of divine predates any scripture, how can you tell that the scriptures you hold dear were really conveyed by a god, and not by the imagination of men? As well intentioned as they may have been when they wrote the thing... As convinced of their divine inspiration as they may have been... How can we discern if they really were only being conduits of the divine will, or if it was all in their heads?
Human psychology again!
Is it irrational to understand human psychology and see it applied for self deception, in spite of many voices pointing out how this deception is operating?
And what is goodness?
Who is hating goodness?
You say "if" goodness is God's light, I say goodness is a property of that which is good. And that which is good is that which leads to maximal happiness and minimal suffering. Happiness and suffering pertain mostly to people. And we, as social animals, have evolved throughout the ages to feel psychologically rewarded when we accomplish this good.
Lack of understanding of psychology easily leads one to attribute such reward mechanism to some hidden entity, which ends up being meshed with the concept of God... But in reality it is not so, no matter how much you perceived it as such.
Once more, your failure to understand psychology leads you to conflate value with a external entity.
I value that woman I told you about above all else. It wasn't always so, but it is now. Her value, to me, has changed.
There is no inherent value imposed by an external cause. There is only the value we attribute.
Once more, as a social species, we have evolved internal intuitive mechanisms to attribute such value to our group, our kin, our family, our tribe... With the advent of countries, we managed to extend this value to our countrymen... And, with the advent of global travel and connectedness, we managed to extend it to the whole world.
But it's still only us doing it to ourselves.
People and their minds. There is no hint of any external entity imposing these things.
But I can understand how ignorance can lead one to think that there is such an external imposition. However, in this day and age, such ignorance is inexcusable. As such, laughter and mockery ensue.
That you persist in your ignorance says something about how your mind is so deeply indoctrinated that it can't release itself and honestly consider that these things have been shown to be products of our evolution as social species.
And that is further proof that your mind is shackled to a particular ideology and cannot, will not, allow itself to consider the truths which we share with you.
Your evidence had been assessed. It has been found to be seriously lacking, but you have repeatedly failed to educate yourself, in spite of repeated attempts to show you exactly where you fail. Again, begin with the names of the fallacies that are presented to you. Try hard to understand how those fit to what you write here. If you can't, ask for help.
Amidst the noise of laughter and insults, someone will do their best to educate you.
But education can only lead so far... You must connect the dots by yourself.
It gives us time to answer these things, even from the crappy touch keyboard on the phone, with its insufferable autocorrect!
(October 8, 2018 at 10:12 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: 1. If you have heard our arguments and found them convincing, consider we have heard your rebuttals and found them unconvincing.
Yes, I've heard your arguments.
No, I haven't found them convincing in the least.
Your arguments always fail to account for actual history and the well known human psychology.
(October 8, 2018 at 10:12 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: 2. If we have the burden proof, you have the burden to accept the proof if proven to you or show that the burden has not been met.
How many times have I/we shown you that the burden has not been met?
You systematically ignore that.
We present you with the names of the fallacies you employ in the hopes that you will, at least, visit the Wikipedia page on those and see if they fit for yourself.
You have not once shown that you have done so.
Instead you keep arguing and slipping down into the same fallacies.
One gets tired of this ignorance parade... (I'm only replying now because I have some two extra hours to waste, courtesy of my non-sleeping brain... Otherwise, I wouldn't even bother)
(October 8, 2018 at 10:12 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: 3. God by definition is the most important being, if an approach to this is made by jest and his scriptures approached with no seriousness, then whether he exists or not, forgive Theists for seeing it irrational and evil to belittle what by definition most revered being in existence.
That definition of God is flawed.
There is a woman I love which is the most important being. By your definition, she is god... Well goddess. And you're right, a bit. She does deserve all the praise, all the admiration, all the reference, all the dedication that you devote to whatever thing it is you mean by "god".
Why do you bring scriptures into this?
Scriptures are man-made books. And most scriptures have a well known time of writing attached. Considering all the history of mankind, and how belief in any sort of divine predates any scripture, how can you tell that the scriptures you hold dear were really conveyed by a god, and not by the imagination of men? As well intentioned as they may have been when they wrote the thing... As convinced of their divine inspiration as they may have been... How can we discern if they really were only being conduits of the divine will, or if it was all in their heads?
Human psychology again!
Is it irrational to understand human psychology and see it applied for self deception, in spite of many voices pointing out how this deception is operating?
(October 8, 2018 at 10:12 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: 4. It won't ever make sense that hating goodness for what is: is irrelevant to morality and hence, if goodness is God's light that hating that mystic link, would be hating for what it is at it's heart.
And what is goodness?
Who is hating goodness?
You say "if" goodness is God's light, I say goodness is a property of that which is good. And that which is good is that which leads to maximal happiness and minimal suffering. Happiness and suffering pertain mostly to people. And we, as social animals, have evolved throughout the ages to feel psychologically rewarded when we accomplish this good.
Lack of understanding of psychology easily leads one to attribute such reward mechanism to some hidden entity, which ends up being meshed with the concept of God... But in reality it is not so, no matter how much you perceived it as such.
(October 8, 2018 at 10:12 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: 5. When we value beings, we value the value in them, if you hate value being linked to God, and value is linked to God, do you hate or love true value of things or do you just make up what value is and attribute to them...try to understand not only the issue of God existence is of vital importance then to love and appreciating and empathy, but that truly to act for the face of God in all things requires to recognize the face of God and his word of light brought to life.
Once more, your failure to understand psychology leads you to conflate value with a external entity.
I value that woman I told you about above all else. It wasn't always so, but it is now. Her value, to me, has changed.
There is no inherent value imposed by an external cause. There is only the value we attribute.
Once more, as a social species, we have evolved internal intuitive mechanisms to attribute such value to our group, our kin, our family, our tribe... With the advent of countries, we managed to extend this value to our countrymen... And, with the advent of global travel and connectedness, we managed to extend it to the whole world.
But it's still only us doing it to ourselves.
People and their minds. There is no hint of any external entity imposing these things.
But I can understand how ignorance can lead one to think that there is such an external imposition. However, in this day and age, such ignorance is inexcusable. As such, laughter and mockery ensue.
That you persist in your ignorance says something about how your mind is so deeply indoctrinated that it can't release itself and honestly consider that these things have been shown to be products of our evolution as social species.
(October 8, 2018 at 10:12 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: 6. I can't take your testification that you are honest and truly assess all evidence seriously - in light of how you guys have display an attitude to dialogue over the years. You chose to be silly. And hence, your testification has become meaningless to me as far as these issues go.
And that is further proof that your mind is shackled to a particular ideology and cannot, will not, allow itself to consider the truths which we share with you.
Your evidence had been assessed. It has been found to be seriously lacking, but you have repeatedly failed to educate yourself, in spite of repeated attempts to show you exactly where you fail. Again, begin with the names of the fallacies that are presented to you. Try hard to understand how those fit to what you write here. If you can't, ask for help.
Amidst the noise of laughter and insults, someone will do their best to educate you.
But education can only lead so far... You must connect the dots by yourself.
