RE: forbidding people to love each other
July 3, 2021 at 10:54 am
(This post was last modified: July 3, 2021 at 10:54 am by R00tKiT.)
(July 3, 2021 at 9:49 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote: That’s what the laws of nature are explicitly defined as. They are descriptions of behaviors.
Okay, so what? We know laws describe how nature behaves and are not some independent entity which physically exists. You explicitly said they don't require a god. And you didn't bother to prove this.
(July 3, 2021 at 9:49 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote: As ever, you supplied this fallacy of equivocation with a demonstrably false assertion even if we correct the equivocation. Gods are not required for descriptive laws of nature, nor are they required for the normative laws of mans construction.
You just keep asserting that they're not required. How do you know? That nature's behavior follows laws is usually presented as evidence of fine-tuning.. Wouldn't a universe designed by a deity be expected to have these descriptive laws ?
Also, you can't compare the universe with man's construction. As man only transforms existent matter.
(July 3, 2021 at 9:49 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Now consider for a moment that, similar to your stated opinions and positions on homosexuality, you are plain and simply wrong here. If these were insisted to be required as concurrent truths, necessary to your beliefs, wouldn’t you want to live at least some room for some human having gotten something wrong about a god?
Don’t you think that it puts Islam and the notion of a god in an awkward position to be subject to and verifiably false based on the whims of your own narrow biases?
If I must believe in a fallacy of equivocation supplied with demonstrably false premise for your god to exist, for your religion to be true.....if I must believe that homosexuality is evil or unnatural.... then, put plainly, these are the criteria by which your god and your religion can be shown to be false as you would concede and as no one disputes.
How exactly do you get from "homosexuality is evil" to "Islam is false". ?? There are homosexual Muslims out there, and although they are commiting a sin, this fact alone doesn't negate their faith. Islam states that a number of practices are evil, not just homosexuality, there is fornication, usury, consuming alcohol, etc. these are just rules of behavior and their existence doesn't prove in any way that Islam is false.
(July 3, 2021 at 10:36 am)AkiraTheFighter24 Wrote: No, you're the one coming to us with the view that God is Real, the burden of proof is still on you. The fact that something DOESN'T have evidence for existing is proof enough that it's most likely made up.
God's existence is supported by deductive, analogical and inductive arguments. Inductive arguments do start from empirical observation of aspects of design/fine-tuning, etc. The reason why God's existence can appear impossible to fully articulate is probably because it's the most self-evident fact, such that trying to reach it begs its truth.