(June 2, 2022 at 5:54 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote:(June 2, 2022 at 4:14 pm)Irreligious Atheist Wrote: It's BS, and I disagree with Vaush on most things, so it doesn't mean anything to me that he approved it. Lung capacity, height, bone structure, hand size, and on and on. Those who try to make the argument that hormone levels are all that matter are fooling themselves.
And all of that's written in stone? And you're sure that the hormones don't have the side effect of limiting any of those factors, or even others?
To an extent, hormones have an effect on limiting some things if taken early enough, but, science and medicine, at this point in 2022, can not perfectly turn a bio male into a bio female. We are just not at that point yet, sadly, for trans people. The amount of advantage really depends on the sport I guess.
Of course there are plenty of cis women athletes who are better than plenty of trans women athletes. This is true. This is usually what people will point out to support trans women in bio womens' sports. Many of those trans women who are not that great might not even have those spots that they have though, if they were cis women. Even if they're pretty mediocre now as trans athletes, they'd likely be even worse if they were cis. Like the youtuber Destiny/ Steven, who I'm sure you know, points out, would it be ok for him to go and play on a team against 10 year olds just because there are 10 year olds in the world better than him at whatever sport it is? No, Destiny playing against 10 year olds sounds ridiculous whether there are 10 year olds better than him or not. The existence of mediocre trans women in sports does not make up for the inevitability of Lia Thomas' coming along.
Like Destiny likes to point out, why do women's sports exist in the first place? It's because the female sex was incapable of competing against the male sex, so therefore we gave them their own thing, based on their sex. It's always been about sex. The creation of it was about sex. Nothing about the mind or how people choose to identify. Such a thing is a completely irrelevant point. It's about sex. Nothing else. And, as far as the data goes, we're still pretty early on in this thing, and the number of people who identify as trans is starting to multiply exponentially as it becomes more accepted and visible in society, which I think is absolutely a good thing btw, and fantastic that people are embracing their true selves. It really is sad that some people here get the impression that I hate trans people and want them genocided just because I think women's sports exist for a reason and we shouldn't abandon that reason and throw it to the wayside. And when activists want biologists like Richard Dawkins cancelled and scrubbed from the internet for asking questions on twitter about gender, if this is considered progress for the world, then no, I don't want that type of progress.
