Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: July 21, 2025, 5:41 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
In your opinion what causes christians to believe in Jesus
RE: In your opinion what causes christians to believe in Jesus
(May 16, 2025 at 12:42 pm)John 6IX Breezy Wrote: Your brain is at least set up as if it needed an internal free agent to make choices. We use terms for it like the central executive, selective attention, awareness, arousal, all of which are connected to conscious experience itself, as if consciousness was a key ingredient in the choice making and decision process. In graduate school we read Libet's paper (also popularized by Sam Harris) in a human cognition class. The conversations we were having about it at the time leaned towards something like "free won't" meaning that the brain had many competing subsystems that present decisions to the central executive, and the executive simply has a kind of veto power to inhibit impulse rather than create them. So there's many ways to think about it.

So in conclusion, I think most of the philosophical arguments against free will are too simplistic, and don't actually explain much of what's actually observed. We have to imagine that what we're seeing isn't actually what we're seeing and that anything that seems like free will is actually an illusion, or worse, a delusion. And that's just scientifically problematic.

Emergent materialists typically agree with this assessment, but with the qualification that free will is by no means absolute.  There is both top-down (free will) and bottom-up (material) causation, rather than everything being bottom-up (strict determinism).  That means there are limits to free will causation, and several of them are the constraints which conditioning, propaganda, and indoctrination place in our thinking until we actually do the work to sort them out.  This is different than the Christian conception of free will, as Grand Nudger pointed out.  Christians depend on word-magic, which doesn't work and so often leads to hypocrisy. I think there is plenty of room in modern psychology for the emergent materialist perspective, but not so much for the Christian message.

So are you a psychologist or a Christian, or are you trying to be both without success?   Angel
Reply



Messages In This Thread
RE: In your opinion what causes christians to believe in Jesus - by Alan V - May 16, 2025 at 3:34 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Why is Jesus Circumcised and not the rest of the christians ? Megabullshit 25 9501 May 13, 2025 at 8:23 am
Last Post: arewethereyet
  Jesus wants passionate christians purplepurpose 3 1044 April 1, 2023 at 3:50 am
Last Post: Goosebump
  Search for Causes Lek 202 25885 January 9, 2020 at 2:47 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  In your opinion purplepurpose 20 6806 July 9, 2017 at 7:17 pm
Last Post: brewer
  Why can't Christians Verify Exactly Where Jesus Was Buried? Firefighter01 278 73722 January 19, 2017 at 8:19 am
Last Post: Little Rik
  Why can't Christians Verify Exactly Where Jesus Was Buried? Firefighter01 0 642 August 31, 2016 at 3:19 am
Last Post: Firefighter01
  Evidence and causes for doubt LadyForCamus 43 10595 March 11, 2016 at 3:27 am
Last Post: Fake Messiah
  AF friends, an opinion on Bible debate, please drfuzzy 25 6643 October 1, 2015 at 10:50 am
Last Post: houseofcantor
  What is your Opinion on Having Required Classes in Logic in Schools? Salacious B. Crumb 43 11551 August 4, 2015 at 12:01 am
Last Post: BitchinHitchins
  Opinion on this Creed Kingpin 80 20506 July 25, 2015 at 5:41 am
Last Post: pocaracas



Users browsing this thread: 6 Guest(s)