Quote:For your"self", apparently.No.
Quote:But they are still alive, aren't they? Which means they haven't completely forfeited their lives.I guess we understand different meanings from the word "forfeit". I'm not a native speaker, so I fear using a wrong word whenever I want to explain myself.
Let me rephrase: I was speaking of laying down your life.
This does not mean that you should commit suicide on the spot, without no reason and no meaning, or that you should knowingly put yourself under life-threatening situations, again, without no purpose or not meaning.
Quote:No, I pointed out the contradiction in their philosophy. The only way for them to have meaning is by destroying the source of all meaning. This contradiction comes from their choice of attributing higher meaning to things that are not real. The only way they can "live" for their god is by dying for it.Well, obviously, they have a different source of meaning than you.
Quote:Thank you for putting forward your corrupt philosophy so succinctly. That is not a philosophy of a free and rational man.And I guess you have the philosophy of a free and rational man. Let us hear your philosophy.
Quote:That is a philosophy that shows the relation between slaves and their masters. From the beginning, men have wanted to control other men.Who is my master, friend? Tell me.
Quote:When it cannot be done by force, it is done by intelligent sounding false philosobabble. Once you convince a man that his life is worth nothing unless it is a used for a purpose other than his own, you have just found yourself a willing slave who'd lay down his life for your purpose.No one convinced me, nor Yunus Emre. They have had their own personal convictions. I personally find freedom in the freedom of my nation. Without the freedom of my nation, I am a slave. The only thing that guarantees my freedom is my nation.
Similarly, Yunus Emre, and many other devotees of a religion or god, found freedom in their devotion. For them, devotion to the world was slavery, devotion to things that are finite, like food, gold or women.
By the way, I could say the same about a person who has found life's meaning in whatever capitalist ideology endorses.
Quote:And since meeting anyone with opposite ideas would simply reveal to this man that his entire philosophy is a mistakeI've met many people who have opposite ideas. My conviction in my philosophy has only gotten stronger. Obviously, since you have not observed any of my previous debates in this here forum, you can speak with such certainty.
Quote:It doesn't matter which and whose purpose is used to replace what could have been yours, whether it is god's or country's or the poors', as long as it is not your own.How far can your own purpose go?
It goes as far as your life.
It is finite and short.
Quote:Why would you think that I cannot best his "achievements", which seem to be meager.I forgive your ignorance.
Quote:Most of the greatest and influential artists known have been individualistsMost, you say. Have you counted all the artists of the world?
How "individualist" was John Lennon, with his humanistic worldviews?
Quote:those who value their view, their judgment and their art above all others.Yes, and most die of drug overdose.
They're great artists, maybe, but they're sad people.
Quote:The capacity to endure extreme hardships does not come without having an indomitable ego that would not succumb to anyone else.They would not endure these hardships if they had this ego. They endured these since they have cast away their ego in front of their ideal.
Quote:And without such an ego, there is no suffering because then their wouldn't be anything meaningful to take away.Perhaps not for people who take the vow of poverty. But this also frees them from many of life's attachments.
I know this sounds like Buddhist texts, but it applies for most hermits, monks and dervishes.
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