(May 14, 2012 at 10:28 am)JesusShaves Wrote:(May 14, 2012 at 8:15 am)FallentoReason Wrote: I think that saying theists are not smart or illogical is extremely unfair and isn't a true reflection of the deeper elements at work.
...
I'm sure you've experienced what I'm trying to say when sometimes a theist has a pretty solid theological argument for something and you can't seem to find a way in to be able to dismantle it. I think it takes an intelligent person to be able to formulate such an argument. But once again, said argument is a reflection of logic at work and not necessarily a truth about reality.
I agree and didn't say that.
Yes I have and those are the ones I most like to deal with. I love it when the theist has a solid understanding of the concepts at hand.
What I'm wonder about now is the rest of them. The ones that base there arguments off of "you can't understand God with logic and reason" (an actual quote). Even these people I will still say are not illogical or stupid, they just ignore logic for God.
In the end I just want to know how to reach people. Even if they are stupid and undoubtedly some of them are.
I'll give you two ways that I find are useful to reach people:
1) say it how it is.
The truth is the truth and it is independent of any one individual's needs and wants. With this in mind, you need to realise that you have to be humble about the points you bring forth because that will show that you are sincere in your motives and you don't have a bias for anything but the truth.
2) Develop the ability to understand their point.
It's only after they have realised that they got 'through to you' that the discussion can really gain momentum. This also allows you to give an argument that directly deals with their points.
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it" ~ Aristotle
