Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: July 21, 2025, 12:32 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Morality: Where do you get yours?
#86
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours?
(May 17, 2012 at 4:02 pm)liam Wrote: well he breaks it down like this:

there are two types of duty, those we must do and those we ought to. If we deny those we must do we are acting immorally and it would be MORE moral to do those we ought to than to not do them (for example, im not immoral for allowing people to hurt each other but i may be more moral if i can stop them without breaking any of the 'must' duties. Basically if i do stop it im better than if i dont).

This also leads to the categorical imperative:
universality- if it'd be ok for everyone to do it everytime they were in that situation it's probably okay
Autonomy- we must treat all people as 'ends and not means', so no manipulation of people ever.
Sapere aude- We must act from our own morality, not religious dogma or what other people think is right (kinda contradictory when you conisder he says we cant perform immoral acts but it still works.)

Ok, let's see them one by one.

The basis of categorical imperative is that "for a particular goal a particular action must be taken". For example, to quench thirst, you must drink. Kant appears to derive universality from this - basically saying that since these statements are true everywhere, the moral statements must be as well.

However, neither of that seems to be necessarily true. For example, generally, in order to survive, you must eat food. However, if the only food around you is poisonous, then in order to survive, you must not eat food. Thus, the argument that every moral action must stand the test of universality is not justified.

Another argument against universality would be that Kant considered morality to be derived from rationality, thus making it like science. Thus, his argument that an action taking place in one set of circumstances is moral if it is not contradictory to consider it taking place in every set of circumstances, is like saying, a reaction taking place under some conditions must also take place under all conditions. As we know, that's incorrect. The universality, if any, should be regarding a principle or a rule - not an action.

Next comes autonomy. This one I can get behind, but with same caveats as above. If another person is the "ends" and that end requires manipulation, then it would be contradictory not to manipulate.

Finally, we are not acting form our own morality if we simply accept his statements as true without judgment. Did he have anything to say about that?
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Creed of Heresy - May 10, 2012 at 7:37 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Tiberius - May 10, 2012 at 8:06 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Tiberius - May 10, 2012 at 8:12 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by NoMoreFaith - May 10, 2012 at 9:52 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Tiberius - May 10, 2012 at 10:27 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by NoMoreFaith - May 10, 2012 at 10:59 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by fuckass365 - May 10, 2012 at 8:31 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by fuckass365 - May 10, 2012 at 8:42 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 10, 2012 at 10:54 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 11, 2012 at 12:40 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by simplexity - May 11, 2012 at 2:02 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 11, 2012 at 7:21 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Violet - May 10, 2012 at 11:27 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Violet - May 10, 2012 at 11:34 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Cinjin - May 10, 2012 at 11:39 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Xyster - May 11, 2012 at 4:33 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 11, 2012 at 10:44 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 12, 2012 at 6:57 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Gooders1002 - May 11, 2012 at 10:29 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 11, 2012 at 1:29 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Ace Otana - May 11, 2012 at 1:18 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 11, 2012 at 2:17 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Whateverist - May 12, 2012 at 11:40 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Reforged - May 11, 2012 at 2:28 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 12, 2012 at 7:40 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 12, 2012 at 9:51 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 12, 2012 at 12:22 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 12, 2012 at 6:49 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by MysticKnight - May 14, 2012 at 10:34 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 14, 2012 at 11:30 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by MysticKnight - May 14, 2012 at 11:06 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by MysticKnight - May 14, 2012 at 11:31 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 14, 2012 at 11:31 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 14, 2012 at 2:17 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Angrboda - May 14, 2012 at 11:04 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Tempus - May 17, 2012 at 12:19 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by liam - May 17, 2012 at 2:59 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 17, 2012 at 3:52 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by liam - May 17, 2012 at 4:02 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 17, 2012 at 11:58 pm
Morality: Where do you get yours? - by el_presidente - May 18, 2012 at 12:03 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by liam - May 18, 2012 at 5:01 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Tempus - May 18, 2012 at 5:56 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 18, 2012 at 6:41 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by NoahsFarce - May 19, 2012 at 1:08 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by NoMoreFaith - May 19, 2012 at 7:10 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Angrboda - May 19, 2012 at 10:46 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by NoahsFarce - May 22, 2012 at 12:51 pm
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by liam - May 19, 2012 at 6:46 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Jinkies - May 19, 2012 at 7:22 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by liam - May 19, 2012 at 7:56 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by liam - May 19, 2012 at 11:01 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by Polaris - May 19, 2012 at 11:28 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by elunico13 - May 28, 2012 at 12:37 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 28, 2012 at 2:18 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by elunico13 - May 28, 2012 at 2:27 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by genkaus - May 28, 2012 at 3:16 am
RE: Morality: Where do you get yours? - by KichigaiNeko - May 28, 2012 at 11:22 am

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Beauty, Morality, God, and a Table FrustratedFool 23 4475 October 8, 2023 at 1:35 pm
Last Post: LinuxGal
  As a nonreligious person, where do you get your moral guidance? Gentle_Idiot 79 12105 November 26, 2022 at 10:27 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Is Moral Nihilism a Morality? vulcanlogician 140 19446 July 17, 2019 at 11:50 am
Last Post: DLJ
  Subjective Morality? mfigurski80 450 68079 January 13, 2019 at 8:40 am
Last Post: Acrobat
  Law versus morality robvalue 16 2275 September 2, 2018 at 7:39 am
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Why I'm here: a Muslim. My Philosophy in life. What is yours;Muslim? WinterHold 43 11778 May 27, 2018 at 12:20 am
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Objective morality: how would it affect your judgement/actions? robvalue 42 11593 May 5, 2018 at 5:07 pm
Last Post: SaStrike
  dynamic morality vs static morality or universal morality Mystic 18 4753 May 3, 2018 at 10:28 am
Last Post: LastPoet
  Can somebody give me a good argument in favor of objective morality? Aegon 19 5775 March 14, 2018 at 6:42 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Morality WinterHold 24 4812 November 1, 2017 at 1:36 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)