Uncovering the Lucan Allegory

[Drich]

It seems like Luke was also into what Mark enjoyed doing--taking something and changing its meaning. What was the intention behind it? Who knows, but all I know is that the evidence is there in black and white for all to see.

Let's have a look at the demon 'Legion' that Jesus cast out of a man:
Luke 8:

I still remember at Bible study about a year ago being told what the theological implications of this passage were. When casting out demons, you can't tell them to go to hell because apparently there will be a time and place for that. Instead you need to use the authority God has given you and cast them out into something material around you.

Did they give you book chapter and verse that supported this 'added teaching?'

First thing's first, let's clear up a geographical mistake Luke made. This will also allow us to correctly compare Luke to two other texts that will aid us later on. Luke says they arrived at 'the country of the Gerasenes' or Gerasa, which is allegedly opposite Galilee i.e. across the Sea of Galilee from the land known as Galilee.

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Well that isn't true. If anything, one could remotely say it's opposite the Jordan River from Samaria.

Lets start by looking at a real map shall we: http://classic.net.bible.org/map.php?map=map1

If you clicked on the link you can almost draw a stright line between the two regions. (Directly across the sea of Galilee ) and if you look at the map topicagraphically you will note the easiest way from Galilee to 'Gerasa" is straight across the sea. so to say "Gerasa is a cross the sea of Galilee." is not inaccurate, because it is literally across the sea (as the bird flies, and the easiest way to get there.)

I'm sure Luke knew this, just as he knew that the actual place this massacre took place was in Capernaum.

You knew what a man was thinking 2000 years before you were born?

Not only that but he must have known that no 'Jesus' guy was involved either.

Empty conjecture.

To understand better what event he ripped off we need to have a look at Josephus' Jewish War and Barnabas' Gospel. Here are the bits:

Jewish War 3:10:8

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The country also that lies over against this lake hath the same name of Gennesareth; its nature is wonderful as well as its beauty; its soil is so fruitful that all sorts of trees can grow upon it, and the inhabitants accordingly plant all sorts of trees there; for the temper of the air is so well mixed, that it agrees very well with those several sorts, particularly walnuts, which require the coldest air, flourish there in vast plenty; there are palm trees also, which grow best in hot air; fig trees also and olives grow near them, which yet require an air that is more temperate. One may call this place the ambition of nature, where it forces those plants that are naturally enemies to one another to agree together; it is a happy contention of the seasons, as if every one of them laid claim to this country; for it not only nourishes different sorts of autumnal fruit beyond men's expectation, but preserves them a great while; it supplies men with the principal fruits, with grapes and figs continually, during ten months of the year 1 and the rest of the fruits as they become ripe together through the whole year; for besides the good temperature of the air, it is also watered from a most fertile fountain. The people of the country call it Capharnaum. Some have thought it to be a vein of the Nile, because it produces the Coracin fish as well as that lake does which is near to Alexandria. The length of this country extends itself along the banks of this lake that bears the same name for thirty furlongs, and is in breadth twenty, And this is the nature of that place.

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We have a problem with your quote in that Chapter three in Josephus' Jewish War' Because it only goes to paragraph 5. That means 3:10:8 does not exist.
http://www.biblestudytools.com/history/f...ter-3.html

Maybe you can provide a link to your version of Josephus' work. i am sure there is an honest mistake here somewhere.

This is a description of Capernaum. In the next section he goes on to discuss what happened at Capernaum:

Jewish War 3:10:9

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But now, when the vessels were gotten ready, Vespasian put upon ship-board as many of his forces as he thought sufficient to be too hard for those that were upon the lake, and set sail after them. Now these which were driven into the lake could neither fly to the land, where all was in their enemies' hand, and in war against them; nor could they fight upon the level by sea, for their ships were small and fitted only for piracy; they were too weak to fight with Vespasian's vessels, and the mariners that were in them were so few, that they were afraid to come near the Romans, who attacked them in great numbers. However, as they sailed round about the vessels, and sometimes as they came near them, they threw stones at the Romans when they were a good way off, or came closer and fought them; yet did they receive the greatest harm themselves in both cases. As for the stones they threw at the Romans, they only made a sound one after another, for they threw them against such as were in their armor, while the Roman darts could reach the Jews themselves; and when they ventured to come near the Romans, they became sufferers themselves before they could do any harm to the ether, and were drowned, they and their ships together. As for those that endeavored to come to an actual fight, the Romans ran many of them through with their long poles. Sometimes the Romans leaped into their ships, with swords in their hands, and slew them; but when some of them met the vessels, the Romans caught them by the middle, and destroyed at once their ships and themselves who were taken in them. And for such as were drowning in the sea, if they lifted their heads up above the water, they were either killed by darts, or caught by the vessels; but if, in the desperate case they were in, they attempted to swim to their enemies, the Romans cut off either their heads or their hands; and indeed they were destroyed after various manners every where, till the rest being put to flight, were forced to get upon the land, while the vessels encompassed them about [on the sea]: but as many of these were repulsed when they were getting ashore, they were killed by the darts upon the lake; and the Romans leaped out of their vessels, and destroyed a great many more upon the land: one might then see the lake all bloody, and full of dead bodies, for not one of them escaped. And a terrible stink, and a very sad sight there was on the following days over that country; for as for the shores, they were full of shipwrecks, and of dead bodies all swelled; and as the dead bodies were inflamed by the sun, and putrefied, they corrupted the air, insomuch that the misery was not only the object of commiseration to the Jews, but to those that hated them, and had been the authors of that misery. This was the upshot of the sea-fight. The number of the slain, including those that were killed in the city before, was six thousand and five hundred.

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Which kinda put the kibosh on this quote as well, until we can sort out this descrepency.

From this we can see quite clearly that ~6 500 Jews were slain or drowned. Now to properly connect the dots let's have a look at Barnabas' 'account' of this: Barnabas 21:1-3

You are quoting the gospel of Barnabas?!?!? (You are) Not only is this not a canocial text it is wasn't written till the mid 16th century and is considered to support the Islamic view of Christ.

So what are the facts that we can draw from Josephus and Barnabas? Here they are:

The only thing we can reference from either of two sources you listed are: best case you had to find/create two noncanocial texts and then cherry pick two seperate writers talking about two very seperate things and then smash them together, all to say the book of luke in it's complete and contextual form is a copy of two seperate works. that by all rights were written after the accepted date of the Gospel of Luke.

That was best case.

what you actually have is either a mis reference on one critical source or a complete faberication (that maybe the work of another), and a reference from a text written 1400 years after said events, shunned by the Christian community and adopted by the Islamic community. to try and build a case against the gospel of luke. All inspired by some guy who wants to sell books like this to people like you. (Books like this meaning something that sounds legitmate and may even stand up to some limited scrutiny, but in the end fold because they are of little substance.)

Well, there you go. There's no theology behind this one. More importantly though, Jesus never comes into it. We're simply talking a massacre which has no connection to the Jesus story whatsoever. That makes me wonder though: what was the intention of this allegory? From Luke's 'perspective' Jesus is responsible for essentially killing these 'demons'. Was Luke spreading propaganda and making the Jews look bad? I mean, calling them swines and getting the LORD to drown them isn't exactly a nice representation of Jews.

Here is where i would do my victory dance but I see an honest effort so, i will wait till your counter arguement...