The New Jesus Timeline

[genkaus]

"IF" we are to give equal sanction to to everyone's autonomy."
You're telling me that this "if" comes from society. Sounds pretty convenient.

This "if" comes from societies geared towards rationality.

And this is where the "if" gets real convenient for justifying. So anyone w/o the capacity for rationality doesn't have a right to live. Hitler did the same thing with individuals of retardation.

You're forgetting the second part -rationality and autonomy. The retarded may not be rational but they still can be autonomous. Thus, while they have the right to live, they do not have certain other rights, such as right to enter into a contract.

Anyone unconcsious would qualify to be killed by this standard. "but they may wake up and be rational". you might say. Then in that case allow the child to be born and hopefully he/she may meet your "standard" of rationality and your society would allow them to live.

No, actually, I would not say that. Like I said, right to life, comes from autonomy, right to freedom comes from rationality. The unborn child has neither and therefore qualifies for neither.

Something would qualify to be killed is it is unconscious and dependent.

The absurd conclusions this leads to is that any social reform would be considered evil. Martin Luther King would be considered wrong to stand up against the societies discrimination against blacks. Also one society can't then say another society is wrong. Evil like pedofilia is allowed in societies. Just get it voted in, but of course we already know how you feel about babies.

What are you blabbering about? Have you completely lost any capacity for understanding?

Read what I wrote again. "The recognition is the basis of society" and the principles are found in "founding and governing principles of the society". Meaning, that the societies should be based on the correct moral code and not vice-versa. And even if the principles might be there, they may still be incorrectly applied, like in case of blacks. Social reform is required to correct that misapplication. And societies that correctly apply those principles does have the right to criticize societies that don't.

Not everyone has to live in a society either. That would be against their autonomy to force them.

Exactly. Everyone should be free to leave whenever they want.

All you have done is transfered one arbitrary moral code from yourself to a group of people.

No. These facts are derived from premises that form the basis of every morality.

As far as you've answered me there hasn't been a rational explanation for any rights for anyone in any society. You are unable to answer my original question with this irrational answer.

There has been. Multiple times. You are just too stupid to understand it.