I Would Like To Talk to Atheists Who Aren't Assholes. Do Any of You Exist?

[Blackrook]

Ok folks, I've been lurking here a little while and between this forum and Reddit, I think it's fair to say there are plenty of atheists who come off as assholes. It's hard to avoid a superior tone when looking at religion/faith/deism rationally. I once wrote a speech in college I wanted to title "God is a Deadbeat Dad." My instructor convinced me it was a bad idea, asking me if I heard anything the preachers in the plaza had to say after I read signs that said "Fags burn in hell" etc. Right or wrong, no one listens when you're being a dick, and it was one of the best lessons I ever learned.

In the off chance Blackrook is still reading, here's what I have to say, sans assholery:

Most people in this thread are calling you a troll because you haven't really asked a question they can answer. I infer from your original post that you're entertaining doubts about the nature and/or existence of god and you're looking for someone who had a similar experience to share their thoughts, so here goes.

I started out Catholic, my mother married a Baptist/Evangelical and until I was about 18 I spent most of my free time either at my job (good ole' protestant work ethic) or at church. I was a card carrying, bible-thumping, Word-studying, school-praying, have-you-heard-the-good-news disciple of Christ. This isn't the convert forum so I'm not going to relate my whole story, but for several reasons I began to doubt and by the time I had lost my faith in the Abrahamic god completely I still held on to the ritual, even if it felt like a lie, because I was afraid of losing the community and afraid of what they would think if I came out atheist (so to speak). It was very scary and painful to lose that certainty of eternal life and a loving creator to look out for me.

To this day I have no problem with faith, in fact I think it's necessary to lead a fulfilling life. It took me a while, but I replaced my faith in god with faith in people, whether specific friends and family or humanity as a whole, and the love they have the capacity to show each other. My mother has shown me more love in my short years than I ever read about in the bible. And as long as anyone professing faith understands that it is a belief and not a certainty I have no reason to argue.

Religion is the problem because it ignores the... personalness(?) of god. I'm not saying there's no value in hearing what others have to say on the nature of your belief, but when you accept someone's authority on the subject over your own you've missed the point at best and done yourself harm at worst. God is whatever you believe he is, based on your life experiences, historical and contemporary observations, and your interpretations of them. When I was member of a large baptist church we had a pastor who invited the men in the congregation to come down and dance in front of the pulpit at the end of service. He based it on some passage about King David dancing in the streets to glorify god. The next week there was a big apology on the front of the church newsletter and he was fired by the elders a couple weeks later. I was disappointed in him for apologizing, and angry that the elders could see neither where he was coming from (personally or biblically) nor the value in a joyous show of our faith. My point being it's a small example of tradition (religion) stamping out reason, and extrapolated to the whole of Christianity, parallels the idea that there are people who can better understand the nature of god than you in spite of having the same tool set.

Whatever you decide you believe it has to be up to you, or you'll never be comfortable with it.

For my part, I still feel like a better christian than most of the christians I know in that I follow Christ's teachings even if I no longer believe in his divinity. Just because someone is an atheist doesn't mean they can't find moral value in the bible, though I believe you can arrive to the same conclusions without it. To be honest, I'm one of those "unknowable" agnostics and I think that debating the existence of god is mental masturbation. If we can't know, then it should have no bearing on the life we live, and time spent thinking on it is wasted. The only conversion you're likely to find here is an understanding of knowledge and how atheists/agnostics perceive it. No one is going to convince you of a deity's non-existence by debunking Noah's Ark or the sun standing still, etc.

The best part about being agnostic though, is that it frees your imagination. You can invent any belief you like and it never seems more outlandish than what you used to believe. Sometimes I like to think that if there are infinite parallel universes, every universe is someone's private heaven and someone's private hell. That there's a version of me somewhere that got everything he ever hoped for and never had to hurt anyone to get it, and the same for everyone else I know and love. Sure that's ridiculous. I know that logically, but it gives me the warm and fuzzies to think about it. And that's the whole point of a modern God in the first place isn't it?

Feel free to PM me if you'd rather have a private chat.

Well, I skipped all the hostile responses and got to this one and said to myself, well at least there's ONE person who gets it.

If you're going to welcome newcomers like I was welcomed, then basically you're going to drive off a lot of people.

And actually, I was reluctant to return. Most of you are making a very bad impression and I have to say you're not doing much good for the cause of atheism.

My question to you is, do you act like this in real life? My guess is no. If you acted like this in real life, people would shun and avoid you.