RE: Who won the vice-presidental debate last night?
October 17, 2012 at 12:17 pm
(This post was last modified: October 17, 2012 at 12:19 pm by festive1.)
Obama's "You didn't build that" comment, when placed in context, was clearly referring to American infrastructure. Big business didn't build the roads, didn't build the power lines, the government did that, not business. Yes, a lot of these infrastructure items were literally built by businesses that were sub-contracted by the government. However, they were planned and paid for by the government, hence the "you didn't build that" statement. Businesses and average Americans benefit everyday from these types of infrastructure projects. Econ 101 teaches us that the goal of business is to make money, the almighty bottom line. To suggest that businesses built these infrastructures to benefit society at large is at odds with the basic driving force of business.
The quote, with my bolding of the line in question, and my italics for how this line was meant to be interpreted, and for giggles, a link to the entire speech: http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-offi...e-virginia
[quote/]
There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me -- because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t -- look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something -- there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. (Applause.)
If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business -- you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.
The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together. There are some things, just like fighting fires, we don’t do on our own. I mean, imagine if everybody had their own fire service. That would be a hard way to organize fighting fires.
[/quote]
As for Romney's line: Forty-seven percent of Americans pay no income tax. So our message of low taxes doesn't connect... And so my job is not to worry about those people—I'll never convince them that they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives.
Perhaps, offering a plan (with details) to create jobs that would net these people a high enough income to be taxed would be the way to reach them? Yes, there is a segment of the population that doesn't want to work, that is content to receive hand-outs and not apply themselves, but that is not the entirety of the 47% Romney is speaking of, far from it. The 47% Romney is mentioning includes people who have worked their entire lives and are now receiving social security benefits and elderly people who receive Medicare.
Then there is the issue of how do we motivate the people who are content to receive hand-outs? How do we get them to want to be a functioning part of society? Romney, just brushes them off and says there's nothing he can do about these people, that's hogwash. To me, this answer lies in leveling the playing field, through dealing with socio-economic inequalities, renewing the discussion of race and how that effects one's chances at socio-economic success, better drug treatment programs, earlier and better interventions for kids from neglectful and abusive homes (including, but not limited to, better parenting education), an over-haul in how Americans in general view the value of everyone's contribution. Admittedly, these aren't the sorts of things that would change overnight, but if that's the direction we need to go, why not start now? Why would anyone be motivated to be a blue-collar laborer, when the social view of blue-collar workers is so negative? Same for white collar workers, who would choose to spend their days and their career being a cog in some corporate machine, if they don't feel valued? That's the crux of this issue, how do we make everyone feel like an asset to society? People who feel like they are making a difference or contribution, even if it's a small one, are far more motivated.
As for the debate itself... I think it was a wash, and I got very frustrated watching Obama avoid coming off as the "angry black man" that was clearly at the forefront of his performance.
P.S. My quotes don't work, but you can clearly see where they are... What am I doing wrong?
The quote, with my bolding of the line in question, and my italics for how this line was meant to be interpreted, and for giggles, a link to the entire speech: http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-offi...e-virginia
[quote/]
There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me -- because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t -- look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something -- there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. (Applause.)
If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business -- you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.
The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together. There are some things, just like fighting fires, we don’t do on our own. I mean, imagine if everybody had their own fire service. That would be a hard way to organize fighting fires.
[/quote]
As for Romney's line: Forty-seven percent of Americans pay no income tax. So our message of low taxes doesn't connect... And so my job is not to worry about those people—I'll never convince them that they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives.
Perhaps, offering a plan (with details) to create jobs that would net these people a high enough income to be taxed would be the way to reach them? Yes, there is a segment of the population that doesn't want to work, that is content to receive hand-outs and not apply themselves, but that is not the entirety of the 47% Romney is speaking of, far from it. The 47% Romney is mentioning includes people who have worked their entire lives and are now receiving social security benefits and elderly people who receive Medicare.
Then there is the issue of how do we motivate the people who are content to receive hand-outs? How do we get them to want to be a functioning part of society? Romney, just brushes them off and says there's nothing he can do about these people, that's hogwash. To me, this answer lies in leveling the playing field, through dealing with socio-economic inequalities, renewing the discussion of race and how that effects one's chances at socio-economic success, better drug treatment programs, earlier and better interventions for kids from neglectful and abusive homes (including, but not limited to, better parenting education), an over-haul in how Americans in general view the value of everyone's contribution. Admittedly, these aren't the sorts of things that would change overnight, but if that's the direction we need to go, why not start now? Why would anyone be motivated to be a blue-collar laborer, when the social view of blue-collar workers is so negative? Same for white collar workers, who would choose to spend their days and their career being a cog in some corporate machine, if they don't feel valued? That's the crux of this issue, how do we make everyone feel like an asset to society? People who feel like they are making a difference or contribution, even if it's a small one, are far more motivated.
As for the debate itself... I think it was a wash, and I got very frustrated watching Obama avoid coming off as the "angry black man" that was clearly at the forefront of his performance.
P.S. My quotes don't work, but you can clearly see where they are... What am I doing wrong?
