Is the catholic church a force for good?

[Esquilax]

You want to argue that the side where the pile of dead and wrecked bodies is not as heavy as the side that represents the charity work.

The other thing to consider is that his argument claims that without the catholic church none of that good work would ever have happened, and I disagree. I think that all the church has done is taken the credit for real people's good work and given it to a god that has done nothing.

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Its is essentiallly a "bash the Catholic Chruch" event, not a serious debate. The anti-Catholic speakers were:

- Christopher Hitchens; an alcoholic, arrogant narcissist and attention seeker who would say anything - anything - no matter how outrageous, ridiculous or controvrsial, if he thought it would have got him some attention. His style of debate is to take the piss and act self-righteously - not look at the facts. He was a performing monkey essentially. His attacks on the Church convince only those who know nothing about the Church, Christianity, or History.

Hitch said more things of substance in that debate that both of the religious speakers combined. Your inability to accept that doesn't make him any of those negative things, and how dare you ascribe motivations to a man when he can't fight back or correct you? That's the height of arrogance.

- Stephen Fry; a self-regarding homosexual man who - like many homosexual people - cannot seem to adopt an objective view of his disordered sexuality. In the modern day he is famous for nothing, bar being a famous homosexual (20 years ago, he was a decent small-time bit-part actor in comedies - Blackadder, Jeeves and Wooster etc) .

Wrongo. Don't cast aspersions against Stephen Fry; currently the guy writes books, and he also hosts the quizz show QI. He's also starred in a number of documentary films, including producing a few himself. He's also been in a number of movies even up to the current day. Just because you're ignorant of his work doesn't mean it doesn't exist. It just means you're ignorant.

He dislikes the Catholic Church because it has the courage to tell the truth about human sexuality -a truth which he would prefer not to hear. He even has the audacity to say "What is it for?" to applause from the crowd, as though the point of the Catholic Church is not obvious, or cannot easily be found out. (Hint - its for doing the type of massive good listed above, you stupid-ass bufter).

Bigot.

secular people base their opinions on what they have been told by the likes of Fry and Hitchins, they do not like to inestigate and find things out for themselves.

You don't get to speak for us, papist. We'll tell you what we believe and how we came to those beliefs, not the other way around.