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On Non-belief
#59
RE: On Non-belief
(April 15, 2013 at 4:57 pm)pocaracas Wrote:
(April 15, 2013 at 12:41 pm)Tex Wrote: I don't think removing any possibility for doubt is required of God. In fact, I think it's required he allow the possibility. The greater the possibility to doubt, the greater the free will. Those who investigate generally (but not always) find the evidence, but some of this evidence must be studied and contemplated before understood. All of this is an exercise of the will.

If we were simply given knowledge beyond the shadow of a doubt, free will would not be very important. It would allow us to eat beef over chicken, but that's about it. Instead, because of the doubt, those that do not want to receive knowledge don't by their own free choice. Those that want the knowledge are free to obtain it by their own workings.

Finally, I don't even know if the knowledge beyond a doubt would help so many people. I can't reasonably say all, but most people would still want to do what they want, make their own way, and basically dismiss the knowledge they have as unimportant.
How does all this measure up with the account of Abraham? You know, the guy that started all the "abrahamic" religions...

Abraham had more specific knowledge that was not the self-evident that is required. God revealed to him more. This isn't a problem, but nothing that God reveals actually increases Abraham's faith. The communication between God and Abraham didn't start Abraham's belief. The communication was given so that the world could be shaped in a particular way.

God revealed to a guy that was a believer anyway. He could reveal knowledge because it would be in accordance with Abraham's will rather than force it against itself.
The Lord bless you and keep you; the Lord make his face to shine upon you and be gracious to you; the Lord lift up his countenance upon you and give you peace.
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Messages In This Thread
On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 12, 2013 at 7:02 am
RE: On Non-belief - by archangle - April 12, 2013 at 8:07 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Neo-Scholastic - April 12, 2013 at 11:05 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 12, 2013 at 11:22 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Neo-Scholastic - April 13, 2013 at 12:06 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 13, 2013 at 12:50 am
RE: On Non-belief - by fr0d0 - April 13, 2013 at 1:22 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 13, 2013 at 2:15 am
RE: On Non-belief - by archangle - April 12, 2013 at 11:53 am
Re: RE: On Non-belief - by frz - April 12, 2013 at 8:03 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by archangle - April 12, 2013 at 8:51 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by fr0d0 - April 13, 2013 at 2:59 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 13, 2013 at 3:20 am
RE: On Non-belief - by fr0d0 - April 13, 2013 at 6:42 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Neo-Scholastic - April 13, 2013 at 10:12 am
RE: On Non-belief - by catfish - April 13, 2013 at 5:15 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by John V - April 13, 2013 at 4:23 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by catfish - April 13, 2013 at 5:14 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Mister Agenda - April 18, 2013 at 6:29 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by ebg - April 13, 2013 at 5:14 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 13, 2013 at 10:48 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by John V - April 14, 2013 at 11:27 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 11:44 am
RE: On Non-belief - by John V - April 14, 2013 at 12:07 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 12:35 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by John V - April 14, 2013 at 12:58 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Neo-Scholastic - April 14, 2013 at 10:29 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by pocaracas - April 13, 2013 at 5:38 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Godschild - April 15, 2013 at 12:09 am
RE: On Non-belief - by pocaracas - April 15, 2013 at 4:51 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Godschild - April 15, 2013 at 9:25 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Esquilax - April 15, 2013 at 7:31 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Godschild - April 15, 2013 at 9:31 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Ryantology - April 15, 2013 at 9:36 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Neo-Scholastic - April 15, 2013 at 8:25 am
RE: On Non-belief - by archangle - April 15, 2013 at 8:36 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Faith No More - April 15, 2013 at 8:59 am
RE: On Non-belief - by ebg - April 13, 2013 at 6:50 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Minimalist - April 13, 2013 at 11:40 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by ebg - April 14, 2013 at 12:18 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Minimalist - April 24, 2013 at 1:13 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Dragonetti - April 24, 2013 at 1:18 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 1:35 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by John V - April 14, 2013 at 1:55 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 1:59 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by John V - April 14, 2013 at 2:05 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 2:11 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by John V - April 14, 2013 at 2:15 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 9:26 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 14, 2013 at 10:05 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 10:21 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 14, 2013 at 10:37 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 10:54 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Neo-Scholastic - April 14, 2013 at 11:15 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 14, 2013 at 11:16 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 15, 2013 at 1:10 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 15, 2013 at 4:36 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 15, 2013 at 12:41 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Neo-Scholastic - April 15, 2013 at 1:21 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by archangle - April 15, 2013 at 4:43 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Esquilax - April 15, 2013 at 1:47 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 15, 2013 at 4:49 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by pocaracas - April 15, 2013 at 4:57 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 15, 2013 at 6:12 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by catfish - April 15, 2013 at 6:16 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by pocaracas - April 15, 2013 at 7:04 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 15, 2013 at 11:18 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 16, 2013 at 1:10 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 18, 2013 at 4:08 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Drich - April 15, 2013 at 4:01 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 15, 2013 at 11:31 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Neo-Scholastic - April 16, 2013 at 8:13 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Drich - April 16, 2013 at 1:10 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 15, 2013 at 6:25 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Jackalope - April 15, 2013 at 7:04 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by catfish - April 15, 2013 at 6:55 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tonus - April 15, 2013 at 7:09 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Whateverist - April 15, 2013 at 7:31 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Neo-Scholastic - April 15, 2013 at 8:37 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Ryantology - April 15, 2013 at 9:29 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by fr0d0 - April 16, 2013 at 12:09 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 16, 2013 at 12:12 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Godschild - April 16, 2013 at 1:42 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 16, 2013 at 3:01 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Godschild - April 16, 2013 at 3:41 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Neo-Scholastic - April 15, 2013 at 9:57 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Ryantology - April 15, 2013 at 11:20 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Godschild - April 15, 2013 at 10:19 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by fr0d0 - April 16, 2013 at 3:04 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 16, 2013 at 3:19 am
RE: On Non-belief - by fr0d0 - April 16, 2013 at 7:31 am
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 16, 2013 at 8:30 am
RE: On Non-belief - by fr0d0 - April 16, 2013 at 7:18 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 16, 2013 at 10:01 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by fr0d0 - April 18, 2013 at 2:59 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 18, 2013 at 9:17 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by fr0d0 - April 19, 2013 at 2:51 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Godschild - April 16, 2013 at 10:49 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 16, 2013 at 10:55 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Godschild - April 17, 2013 at 5:40 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Ryantology - April 16, 2013 at 1:38 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 16, 2013 at 3:26 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Darkstar - April 16, 2013 at 3:28 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 17, 2013 at 12:54 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Esquilax - April 17, 2013 at 12:58 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 17, 2013 at 2:00 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Esquilax - April 18, 2013 at 12:55 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Fidel_Castronaut - April 17, 2013 at 1:28 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by CleanShavenJesus - April 17, 2013 at 5:44 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 17, 2013 at 9:35 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Brayton.l - April 17, 2013 at 9:44 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 17, 2013 at 11:44 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Ryantology - April 18, 2013 at 1:31 am
RE: On Non-belief - by CleanShavenJesus - April 18, 2013 at 5:41 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by CleanShavenJesus - April 17, 2013 at 9:55 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by CleanShavenJesus - April 16, 2013 at 3:50 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Fidel_Castronaut - April 16, 2013 at 6:51 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 18, 2013 at 12:03 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 18, 2013 at 2:43 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Ryantology - April 18, 2013 at 3:40 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 18, 2013 at 9:46 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by FallentoReason - April 18, 2013 at 10:08 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by pocaracas - April 19, 2013 at 4:51 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 19, 2013 at 4:26 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by ThomM - April 19, 2013 at 6:02 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Ryantology - April 18, 2013 at 10:38 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Fidel_Castronaut - April 19, 2013 at 2:15 am
RE: On Non-belief - by pocaracas - April 19, 2013 at 5:57 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 19, 2013 at 7:25 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Simon Moon - April 19, 2013 at 7:41 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 19, 2013 at 8:56 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Ryantology - April 20, 2013 at 2:10 am
RE: On Non-belief - by fr0d0 - April 20, 2013 at 3:31 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Esquilax - April 20, 2013 at 2:45 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Ryantology - April 19, 2013 at 7:31 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 20, 2013 at 9:22 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by ThomM - April 21, 2013 at 1:25 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 23, 2013 at 11:42 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by Ryantology - April 24, 2013 at 12:58 am
RE: On Non-belief - by Tex - April 24, 2013 at 6:37 pm
RE: On Non-belief - by The Grand Nudger - April 24, 2013 at 8:27 am
RE: On Non-belief - by The Grand Nudger - April 24, 2013 at 6:39 pm

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