On Non-belief

[FallentoReason]

So it is 'your belief' (by differing to this guys logic) That X is needed for salvation? If so does that make Jesus a Liar? He seems to think there wasn't a 'set of propostition needed for salvation.' He taught the oppsite, that we only needed that faith of a mustard seed.

So we have our first candidate for the set x; we need to believe that Jesus was the Son of God. See, this isn't too hard Drich!

2) If God exists, he has the power to make us know x is true.

And He does to all of those who act on their faith.

No comment here.. let's see where you go with this..

3) If God exists, and given (1) & (2), we should know x is true.

If X Can simply be the absolute knoweledge of God. Then God can let us know that X is true.

Which he hasn't. A Tibetan monk raised that way as a kid will be engulfed in flames for all eternity for something he didn't do nor something he could have avoided thanks to your god's faulty divine plan.

4) We do not know x is true.

If you do not know it is because you have not asked, sought, or knocked as outlined in Luke 11.

Delusion 11 is the last thing you should be bringing up. Clearly you haven't understood the problem of non-belief. The Tibetan monk won't ever come across Delusion 11, nor will an Eskimo, or exotic tribes hidden in rain forests. All these will burn to a crisp for something they were completely unaware of.

C) Given (3) & (4), God does not exist.

..And If 'X' is a known quanity then can it also be said God does exist?

Your 'visit' to hell should be able to answer this about if x is known.

rebellion is not the objection to free will here. When people have a true heart for God they will seek him out no matter the obstacial, when they do not then then nothing that can be provided in the way of proof or convincing will make them give themselves over to God. Christ speaks of this when He addresses the Luke warm believers. These people know of God without reservation or doubt, they simply do not give themselves to God, as God asks us to do.(Which is rebellion enough to sentence them to Hell) Which is why Christ identifies them as non believers. There will be no greater torment than being in Hell not not understand why you are there. The current seperation God has placed between non believers and believers is for the benfit of those non-believers who are honest enough with themselves to claim that title.

Luke warm believers are on the fence for a reason; the evidence/reasoning for the Bible to be true is inconclusive. Divine Plan Epic Fail.

Without this clear seperation the vast majority of those in Hell would have gone through the motions of Christianity and may not fully understand why they are there.

Get your head out of your butt. You point to someone who was lucky enough to bump into the "truth" of the cosmos because they were born in the Western world and then they ruined it for themselves? Umm... Tibetan monk? Eskimos? Exotic tribes unexposed to the outside world? Australian Aboriginals isolated from us for around 40 000 years?

Imagine their reactions Drich.

mt7:21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

Seriously, get your head out of your butt. You never seize to sicken me in one way or another..

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@Drich

You know what.. it's funny how you decided to approach your rebuttal. You were making it seem like the entire world is back in the 1st century C.E. and we're all aware of the local news about some apocalyptic preacher whose 'the anointed' running around towns. It's like we're unaware that there are vast seas that, if we cross, will lead to unexplored lands and ears that are yet to hear our Gospel. It's as if.. the justice that we believe our God exercises covers all, for all have heard the Gospel of salvation.

Oh wait. Those were the exact conditions the NT was written in. Is it the work of fallible man, or omniscient Divinity? I wonder...