(September 16, 2013 at 4:43 pm)Godschild Wrote:
Yes it does, however I believe we both can find commonality with many people, what do you think.
max-greece Wrote:That is exactly the direction I was heading in. Whatever a person's background, religion or beliefs underlying it all is a basic commonality which we might call the human condition.
Yes we all have common desires and even needs. The needs are generally the same with all peoples , the desires may vary but are common to many. The greatest desires IMO should be helping others, for those who believe, it should be the desire as God sees fit, for those who do not believe, they should look and see the needs and try to meet them. Actually I see the human condition differently, it started with Adam and Eve's disobedience in the Garden and continues to this day.
Quote:Actually I can't do this, many times on this forum I've been ask to suppose and have replied that is not how I conduct my life. Supposing is not real life and leads to no "real" conclusions. You should understand I have no doubts God's real, none at all, not one speck. God has proven Himself to me beyond a shadow of doubt. That's why you will see confidence in my answers, not arrogance as some here believe.
max-greece Wrote:I wouldn't get hung up on the supposition aspect. What I was trying to establish was that there are parallels that can be established. There are certainly differences too. I cannot imagine, for example having anything in my life that I was that certain about as you claim your belief in God is. On the other hand the lack of said certainty doesn't really appear to impinge on my life. I am not seeking such a level of certainty.
I did not start out with that absolute certainty, it came over time and experience, certainty is a value for my life, I've been that way for as long as I can remember. I can say this, trying to attain certainty can be a burden at times, but that is not true with learning about God, it is a delight.
GC Wrote:It's a great thing when one can love their neighbor as one's self. It's actually something I see as extremely difficult, why, because I've seen very few that can accomplish this Christian or not. I'm not saying you have not done such a worthy thing in your life, I do know I have failed at times. I do not doubt we may look the same in our outwardly actions, however God looks into my heart for the reasons I do things, I'm accountable in this way and I'm fine with that. I know He will forgive me when I do things for reasons other than out of love.
max-greece Wrote:It must be strange to seek forgiveness in this way. If I behave badly to a person I would seek forgiveness from them directly possibly, but from a 3rd party onlooker......
No, not at all, when one sins it's always against God first then the person, if the sin was committed against a person. Jesus tells us to go also to the person one was sinned against and ask for forgiveness. I see God as the first person because it is His laws that are broken. There are times when one sins and the party the sin took place with, well that party may not see it as a sin and an apology will not be received by them. However the sin is committed and needs to be forgiven and God is the only place to go.
GC Wrote:I can agree with that, yet for me and the free choice I made, there's only one right way in which I can handle my life, you may see that as limiting yet I see it as freedom.
max-greece Wrote:How I see your life is of no relevance here. I'd hope it is obvious that in this thread I am not looking to dissect you beliefs except where I can evaluate the room for tolerance of others.
I hope you will dissect my beliefs, they are who I am. I also have tolerance for others, what good would it be for me to be intolerant of others, they would only reject my beliefs right off because of the enmity on my behalf. I could not blame them either, Christ never taught intolerance, He taught love.
maxgreece Wrote:That you accept there are many ways to live a good life is enough, assuming no hidden judgement on your part.
As far as man's view of a good life, yes I can accept there are different ways to a good life, but not so according to God, He says no one is good, that is according to who God is. I do try to reserve judgment on people who do not believe, unless they abuse my beliefs, I'm human after all and do fall short of the will of God to often.
GC Wrote:The good life (wince) is not my end goal, it is pleasing God first and helping others who want to know about God, as Jesus said to be a follower of His we must put Him first over everything else. This does not mean we can't enjoy life, Christians do enjoy many things non-Christians do, we try doing them within what God desires. I know this is hard for people who are not Christians to understand, when one puts Christ above everything else, those other things like family become elevated to a new level of love and importance to one's life, even higher than they would have been otherwise. Living for Christ gives a person a new perspective about love and caring for others that allows us to elevate others to a level that is above our own self. Please do not get me wrong I'm not saying Christians are necessarily better people, I'm saying through Christ we will lower ourselves so that we can elevate others above us and see their importance to and for us in life. So as for me and other Christians God is absolutely necessary.[/quote]
GC
I do not know if you want to reply to this but, if you do and have other things going that are more important take your time and PM me when you answer, if you do.
max-greece Wrote:I suppose that whether the "good life" is your primary goal or not doesn't really matter in as much as it relates to your dealings with others.
I'd hope you have interpreted "good life" to mean honest and decent in your interactions rather than swilling down copious amounts of Champagne and Oysters.
Dealing with others is the most important part of life, doing it with kindness and love is what determines if it's good.
As far as oysters go bring them on, I can eat them till I'm about to bust, and an occasional beer with them is okay too.
max-greece Wrote:The question is, however, that whilst for you and other Christians, God is essential, can you see that for others he isn't, or at least doesn't appear to be?
I can see how others sees that God is not essential to themselves, however I can not believe that He is not essential to everyone, I know what He can bring into one's life and it is amazing.
GC
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
