The vast complexity of living things proves that God exists (proof 1)

[ThomM]

SPG, remember [http://atheistforums.org/thread-21129-post-515511.html#pid515511]that talk we had[/url] about first establishing that your one and only source book can be taken seriously before any claims or extrapolations made from it can possibly make the slightest sense?

Until you can do that, why should we take anything you pull from the book as any kind of authority? How can you claim it proves anything if you haven't proved it to bear any resemblance to reality?

The quote from the Holy Bible was just a lead in to the ensuing discussion.

Proof 1 is only to establish that there must be a Creator, God.

After establishing that God exists, the Holy Bible will be established as His revelation. That part is still to come.

On Dawkins' scale, what number are you?

Sorry - but the problem is that even if we ASSUME the statements from the bible are correct - you are assuming that a creator is a god.

And that is simply not true

However - the existence of ANYTHING -= would only provide a need to THAT thing to be created - not anymore. It fails to support the rest of the FAIRY TALES of religion about almighty gods and the rest of the supernatural nonsense

All a creator would need to be is a being with the power to "create" = and nothing more. IT also fails to prove that a creator needs to still exist - it is just as possible that the creator died in the process of creation - or it could also support the Deist concept of a god that ONLY creates and then does no more.

And as far as the bible being the revelation of a creator - since YOU have not established that a creator existed AFTER the creation - you would need to do so BEFORE you can claim that the bible is revelation of a creator.

Of course - you would ALSO need to provide PROOF of the further supernatural powers you attribute to your god -= ALL OF THEM - ONE BY ONE.

Sorry - your claim is rejected without far more proof