(April 21, 2014 at 10:52 am)Metalogos Wrote: I am interested in keeping the argument fixed in the natural world as that is the only one that we can access with our senses and test our hypotheses against.But asking us to consider a first cause is also going "outside" our natural universe. Unless you're implying this first cause exists inside our universe, in which case it would also be bound to the beginning/end laws of our universe.
So either way, an eternal universe or a first cause of our universe is not going to stay within the realm of our known universe.