I'm glad you clarified what you meant, and I completely agree with the Bill Maher thing. I actually wrote an article couple of years ago pondering whether to write an open letter to him about it: http://atheistblogger.com/2008/10/03/wha...ill-maher/
To be honest, I think a fair share of the blame has to go to Dawkins and his ridiculous scale of belief, which doesn't help the issue. Myself and a theist member of the forums (Arcanus) developed the "Hayter-Braeloch Scale" last year:
NOTES:
i. The word "gods" in the following scale includes: belief in god (singular), gods (plural), God (personal), and goddess (feminine); and beliefs that "gods" are either involved or uninvolved in the world and its affairs (e.g., monotheism, pantheism, deism, etc.).
ii. The word "gnostic" does not refer to the syncretistic religious movements of Gnosticism, but rather to the cogent strength of the arguments for the existence or non-existence of "gods" (i.e., the premises enjoy greater probability than their denials).
iii. The word "agnostic" does not refer to either the knowability of "gods" or to epistemic apathy, but rather to the questionable strength of the arguments for the existence or non-existence of "gods" (i.e., the premises and their denials are equally probable).
iv. The word "theist" does not refer to a belief in a god who rules the universe, but to belief in god generally. It is the opposite of atheism rather than distinct from deism.
1. Gnostic Theist
Those who believe that gods exist, and hold that the existence of gods can be conclusively established.
2. Agnostic Theist
Those who believe that gods exist, and hold that the existence of gods cannot be conclusively established.
3. Apatheist
Those who are uncertain regarding the existence of gods. They may sometimes 'believe' and other times 'not believe' that gods exist, and question whether the issue has ultimate consequences.
4. Agnostic Atheist
Those who do not believe that gods exist, and hold that the non-existence of gods cannot be conclusively established.
5. Gnostic Atheist
Those who do not believe that gods exist, and hold that the non-existence of gods can be conclusively established.
To be honest, I think a fair share of the blame has to go to Dawkins and his ridiculous scale of belief, which doesn't help the issue. Myself and a theist member of the forums (Arcanus) developed the "Hayter-Braeloch Scale" last year:
NOTES:
i. The word "gods" in the following scale includes: belief in god (singular), gods (plural), God (personal), and goddess (feminine); and beliefs that "gods" are either involved or uninvolved in the world and its affairs (e.g., monotheism, pantheism, deism, etc.).
ii. The word "gnostic" does not refer to the syncretistic religious movements of Gnosticism, but rather to the cogent strength of the arguments for the existence or non-existence of "gods" (i.e., the premises enjoy greater probability than their denials).
iii. The word "agnostic" does not refer to either the knowability of "gods" or to epistemic apathy, but rather to the questionable strength of the arguments for the existence or non-existence of "gods" (i.e., the premises and their denials are equally probable).
iv. The word "theist" does not refer to a belief in a god who rules the universe, but to belief in god generally. It is the opposite of atheism rather than distinct from deism.
1. Gnostic Theist
Those who believe that gods exist, and hold that the existence of gods can be conclusively established.
2. Agnostic Theist
Those who believe that gods exist, and hold that the existence of gods cannot be conclusively established.
3. Apatheist
Those who are uncertain regarding the existence of gods. They may sometimes 'believe' and other times 'not believe' that gods exist, and question whether the issue has ultimate consequences.
4. Agnostic Atheist
Those who do not believe that gods exist, and hold that the non-existence of gods cannot be conclusively established.
5. Gnostic Atheist
Those who do not believe that gods exist, and hold that the non-existence of gods can be conclusively established.
