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Do you ever doubt your atheism?
#36
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism?
(August 17, 2014 at 12:54 am)whateverist Wrote:
(August 17, 2014 at 12:05 am)FallentoReason Wrote: I doubt it daily, based on the fact that I can't account for consciousness through naturalism. But I guess that means I've been pushed to the view that perhaps this universe isn't all that there is, and after death we 'naturally' proceed to the next stage of consciousness, whatever or however that might be. This isn't to say it makes me wonder if "GOD" is real, because adopting that view would be to take a step backwards, philosophically speaking.

I don't understand why, in the absence of a satisfying account of consciousness, you would be tempted to think consciousness persists after death. (Before birth too?)

Because if consciousness can't be explained by way of the mechanics of this universe, doesn't that mean it must arise from outside of this universe? Mind you, plug in what you will if that's the case; brains in a vacuum, Descarte's Demon, the Matrix etc etc.

Quote:In general, when something is hard to understand in terms of what we presently understand about the natural world, do you find non-natural options tempting?

hmm.. it's not that simple, because it's not a dichotomy like you've presented it. In terms of consciousness, I see philosophical problems when trying to explain it through naturalism. I just don't think particles can ever be arranged in such a way as to then hold a *belief* about other particles, or thoughts/emotions/attitudes towards other particles. So that's just merely the conceptual side of things. Thus, scientifically speaking, I think the project is doomed already. It would be like trying to imagine a square circle, and despite the conceptual difficulties, you still believe it can be found scientifically.

As an agnostic, I'm always open to the idea that I'm wrong on this, but given the philosophy thus far, I highly doubt there's a natural explanation for consciousness.

Quote:Whatever there is that can be understood at all I would consider natural. If there is anything super-, it is simply how hard some things are to understand. Assigning a difficult phenomenon like consciousness to the black box of 'the supernatural' doesn't tempt me.

Sure, I'm open to the idea that consciousness fits into the natural category. But again, actually proving this to be so seems almost like an impossibility.
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it" ~ Aristotle
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Messages In This Thread
Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - August 16, 2014 at 2:22 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Minimalist - August 16, 2014 at 2:57 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by rexbeccarox - August 16, 2014 at 3:02 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 16, 2014 at 3:08 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - August 16, 2014 at 3:46 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Esquilax - August 16, 2014 at 3:32 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Tobie - August 16, 2014 at 3:44 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by ignoramus - August 16, 2014 at 6:54 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - August 16, 2014 at 8:06 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - August 16, 2014 at 8:40 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Marsellus Wallace - August 17, 2014 at 4:53 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Cato - August 16, 2014 at 9:20 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 16, 2014 at 10:46 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - August 16, 2014 at 2:52 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Tonus - August 16, 2014 at 11:14 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by CindysRain - August 16, 2014 at 7:50 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Simon Moon - August 16, 2014 at 1:08 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by ShaMan - August 16, 2014 at 1:11 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - August 16, 2014 at 1:15 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 16, 2014 at 2:11 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Jackalope - August 16, 2014 at 2:35 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Anomalocaris - August 16, 2014 at 3:00 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 16, 2014 at 3:40 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mister Agenda - August 16, 2014 at 7:07 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by pocaracas - August 16, 2014 at 7:20 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - August 16, 2014 at 8:50 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Brakeman - August 16, 2014 at 7:42 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Fidel_Castronaut - August 16, 2014 at 7:49 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by ignoramus - August 16, 2014 at 9:00 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Eel_LahjicK - August 16, 2014 at 9:32 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by ignoramus - August 16, 2014 at 10:18 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Eel_LahjicK - August 17, 2014 at 12:42 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 16, 2014 at 10:57 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by vorlon13 - August 16, 2014 at 11:17 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by FallentoReason - August 17, 2014 at 12:05 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - August 17, 2014 at 12:54 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by FallentoReason - August 17, 2014 at 1:34 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - August 17, 2014 at 12:39 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by ignoramus - August 17, 2014 at 2:10 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by FallentoReason - August 17, 2014 at 2:19 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by LostLocke - August 17, 2014 at 8:20 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by FallentoReason - August 17, 2014 at 9:12 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - August 17, 2014 at 3:52 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by ignoramus - August 17, 2014 at 8:08 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Little lunch - August 17, 2014 at 8:23 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 17, 2014 at 8:35 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 17, 2014 at 10:17 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 17, 2014 at 10:26 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by CapnAwesome - August 17, 2014 at 10:50 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 17, 2014 at 11:02 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 17, 2014 at 11:15 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by SteelCurtain - August 17, 2014 at 11:33 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by paulpablo - August 17, 2014 at 11:49 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by XK9_Knight - August 17, 2014 at 12:29 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - August 17, 2014 at 12:34 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Dystopia - August 17, 2014 at 12:41 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 17, 2014 at 1:18 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - August 18, 2014 at 9:13 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - August 17, 2014 at 1:53 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by FallentoReason - August 18, 2014 at 12:25 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mycroft - August 18, 2014 at 12:44 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by robvalue - August 18, 2014 at 4:48 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by RobbyPants - August 18, 2014 at 1:25 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Little lunch - August 18, 2014 at 6:36 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 18, 2014 at 6:36 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - August 18, 2014 at 7:03 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by The Grand Nudger - August 18, 2014 at 7:09 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by ComradeMeow - August 20, 2014 at 1:45 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Dawsonite - August 30, 2014 at 5:06 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by psychoslice - August 30, 2014 at 5:09 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Diablo - August 30, 2014 at 5:17 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by ComradeMeow - August 30, 2014 at 7:38 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by psychoslice - August 30, 2014 at 8:30 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Natachan - August 30, 2014 at 7:38 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - August 31, 2014 at 1:16 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by BlackMason - August 31, 2014 at 2:54 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 2, 2014 at 6:48 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - September 2, 2014 at 8:08 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 2, 2014 at 8:34 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by BlackMason - September 3, 2014 at 10:08 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by onebluethinker - September 2, 2014 at 5:47 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - September 2, 2014 at 8:38 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 3, 2014 at 8:21 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by MJ the Skeptical - September 2, 2014 at 8:48 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Ben Davis - September 3, 2014 at 8:28 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 3, 2014 at 8:44 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - September 3, 2014 at 8:49 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 3, 2014 at 9:24 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by robvalue - September 3, 2014 at 10:45 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Dawsonite - September 3, 2014 at 1:30 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Clueless Morgan - September 3, 2014 at 2:13 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by robvalue - September 3, 2014 at 3:55 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by naimless - September 4, 2014 at 5:33 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 5, 2014 at 12:34 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by naimless - September 5, 2014 at 3:34 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Brian37 - September 5, 2014 at 12:51 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 5, 2014 at 1:18 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Brian37 - September 5, 2014 at 8:09 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 5, 2014 at 9:30 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by vendetta - September 6, 2014 at 6:53 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - September 6, 2014 at 9:00 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Chas - September 6, 2014 at 7:09 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 6, 2014 at 10:56 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Chas - September 6, 2014 at 11:08 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 6, 2014 at 11:21 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - September 6, 2014 at 11:53 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Chas - September 6, 2014 at 11:59 am
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 6, 2014 at 12:18 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Whateverist - September 6, 2014 at 1:59 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Ryantology - September 6, 2014 at 1:35 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Mudhammam - September 6, 2014 at 2:03 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by *Deidre* - September 6, 2014 at 3:24 pm
RE: Do you ever doubt your atheism? - by Thumpalumpacus - September 10, 2014 at 3:29 pm

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