RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
October 30, 2014 at 8:37 pm
(This post was last modified: October 30, 2014 at 8:46 pm by Tsun Tsu.)
(October 30, 2014 at 8:14 pm)Simon Moon Wrote:(October 30, 2014 at 7:05 pm)Tsun Tsu Wrote: So the question... Does absolute universal moral truth exist? Is there ANYTHING where it can be said that it is morally true universally?
No.
Quote:For instance: "Rape is ALWAYS wrong" <<<This would be considered a moral truth. Is it universally true? Is it true even if society deemed that rape was perfectly acceptable?
If there is a victim and a perpetrator, it is always wrong.
Secular morality is not rocket science.
We all live in the same physical universe, with the same physical bodies, subject to the same physical laws.
From that I can extrapolate that what is the best for my well being is almost assuredly what others want as well.
Life is preferable to death, health is preferable to disease, comfort is preferable to pain, etc.
Even if society deemed rape acceptable, would not make it so. You know how you can tell? Ask the victim.
I bolded parts of your quote, and thanks for answering. Your bolded quotes seem to make for a universal truth.
You are very strongly asserting that one human raping another is always wrong under any circumstance. This would be the equivalent of a universal truth, because it is true regardless of time, location or public opinion. How does your view in any way differ with holding it as universally true that rape is wrong?
(October 30, 2014 at 8:36 pm)pocaracas Wrote:(October 30, 2014 at 8:32 pm)Tsun Tsu Wrote: Let me clarify this to make sure I am addressing it correctly.. are you postulating then that it is not universally wrong or bad for a human male to rape a sheep? And would you then hold that the only alternative is then true, "it is sometimes good for human males to rape sheep"?
Thanks for making it clear for me
And can you think of any circumstance that would make human to human rape a "good" thing, or do you assert that it is "always wrong despite social opinions"?
As far as I'm concerned, I'm indifferent to whether it's good or bad to rape a sheep.
Some people may be grossed by it, but then again, many are grossed by looking at certain members of the human population... certain obese members....
Is something gross immoral?
So if I understand you correctly, your opinion is that raping sheep is neither good nor bad. Am I correct?
And how about human to human... is it ALWAYS wrong or sometimes Good? And could you provide an example of the "good" rape, if you are of the opinion that it is sometimes good?
Thank you
(October 30, 2014 at 8:11 pm)Cato Wrote:(October 30, 2014 at 7:59 pm)Tsun Tsu Wrote: Yes... hence the word "rape" being used here to differentiate consensual from non consensual sex. To be forcibly raped. Is it universally true that it is wrong to rape?
My comment was in reference to you considering a circumstance where rape was accepted. If it's accepted it's not rape.
Accepted by society... forcible sex is still rape
(October 30, 2014 at 8:07 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote:(October 30, 2014 at 7:59 pm)Tsun Tsu Wrote: Yes... hence the word "rape" being used here to differentiate consensual from non consensual sex. To be forcibly raped. Is it universally true that it is wrong to rape?
Define the scope of "universally true". To humanity? To all known species? To all moral agents, known and unknown? Something else?
By universally true, I mean it is true regardless of time or location or prevailing opinion. Does the truth that rape is wrong supersede human social acceptance? If so, then the Atheist has to deal with a higher moral code.
Do you recall what was revealed the day the music died?