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Current time: September 29, 2024, 2:33 am

Poll: Universal moral truths exist
This poll is closed.
I agree
21.43%
3 21.43%
I disagree
78.57%
11 78.57%
Total 14 vote(s) 100%
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Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wrong"?
RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
(February 18, 2015 at 1:42 pm)wiploc Wrote:
(October 30, 2014 at 7:05 pm)Tsun Tsu Wrote: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wrong"?

Yes.

I'm not clear on what you mean by "absolute," but I'm saying yes.



Quote:For instance: "Rape is ALWAYS wrong" <<<This would be considered a moral truth. Is it universally true?

Rape is always wrong.



Quote: Is it true even if society deemed that rape was perfectly acceptable?

That has nothing to do with it. When slavery was acceptable, it was still wrong.


(October 30, 2014 at 7:14 pm)Tsun Tsu Wrote: Would this extend to being wrong for any advanced race anywhere in time or space?

Something is wrong if it tends to make people unhappy. You could invent a world in which rape was like going to the dentist (you don't want it now, but you'll thank the perpetrator later). Then, because it wouldn't tend to increase unhappiness, rape wouldn't be wrong.


(October 30, 2014 at 7:16 pm)Tsun Tsu Wrote: Would you consider rape to be wrong even for those who deem it acceptable?

Sure.



Quote: And what about advanced life across the universe. If it exists, would rape also be wrong for that society, even if they accept it as normal or "ok"?

Whether people accept something has little to do with whether it is wrong.


Quote: I believe most people are agreeing that morality is subjective.

You haven't even asked about subjectivity. You asked about universality. And it's a weasel word anyway, frequently used for equivocation.



Quote: Rape is wrong for one group, but is acceptable to another. Is this correct?

No, it's absurd.


Quote: So far, in my results from other sites, Theists would regard rape as universally wrong despite those viewing it as acceptable.

Theists believe rape is wrong only when their gods forbid it. They raped without compunction in Kosovo, because their rules changed. They believe murder is universally wrong, and then word comes down that they aren't to suffer a witch to live. Ask Boko Haram what the unchanging universal rules are.


Quote: In other words, theists believe "Universal truth is bigger than society, larger than the universe. They would say it is universally true regardless of dissenting views. Those holding the opposite view are simply wrong".
In this case the theist would say that those regarding rape as acceptable are wrong... it is still an evil or "wrong" thing to do.

Evil or wrong? You don't want to conflate evil with sin. Evil isn't sin, it is the punishment for sin.


Quote: How does the atheist counter this?

Our morality is just as objective as theirs. It is just as universal as theirs. It is at least as rationally justifiable as theirs.



(October 30, 2014 at 9:13 pm)Tsun Tsu Wrote: You'd be surprised how "sciency" I can get I'm sure Smile

As long as you aren't defining terms, and as long as you oppose "subjective" to "universal" rather than to "objective," I'm not worried about you getting too sciency.

I almost perfectly agree with you. And if I were to point out the philosophical difference, people would focus on that and forget the majority agreement, so I will not bother with it. Philosophically, it may be a "big" difference, but practically, it isn't worth bothering about.

Rape is always wrong. When people try to change the meaning of the term "rape" to be something other than what the word means in English, then they might come up with some claim, but then they would no longer be talking about rape.

It is just wrong, so don't do it. Ever. No matter what.

(Of course, coming from me, this level of agreement will likely hurt your standing, so you may wish to distance yourself from my other posts.)

"A wise man ... proportions his belief to the evidence."
— David Hume, An Enquiry Concerning Human Understanding, Section X, Part I.
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Messages In This Thread
RE: Is Rape ALWAYS "wrong"? - by Surgenator - October 31, 2014 at 12:29 am
RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr... - by Pyrrho - February 19, 2015 at 8:28 pm

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