(August 22, 2010 at 12:18 am)RAD Wrote: So you're saying two people can make two inconsistent contradictory arguments and both be making a rational argument? If so what is the point of even claiming to be rational?I believe that is something I've managed to prove beyond a reasonable doubt given that I've supplied the actual definition of the term 'rational.'
Though I don't believe any mention has been made until the statement about about the arguements also being inconsistent, which is something that will need to be clarified.
(August 22, 2010 at 12:18 am)RAD Wrote: You mean if two arguments contradict they can both be true? If so, I think people in search of truth would be entirely confusedWhat do you think rational means?
If I've proven nothing else, it's that you entire premise for this thread is wrong which means that two arguements can both be rational and mutually exclusive. If you've ever paid any attention to two scientists disagreeing over something, then yes, that is exactly what I'm saying and no, it doesn't appear to lead to any confusion if you know the topic, concepts, and lingo the disagreement covers.
(August 22, 2010 at 12:18 am)RAD Wrote: Well no I said to go ahead and apply a context which makes them mean something else.Something other than what?
Since none of those arguements have context in the first place, the fact that you listed them in a manner that points out some arguements contradicting other arguements doesn't prove anything! It certainly doesn't prove that any of the individual arguements have or don't have merit, it doesn't prove that rational arguements aren't. It doesn't even prove that whomever spoke those arguements are even necessarily contradicting one anther. It depends entirely on the topic, the arguement that those arguements are supposed to be countering, and the point that all involved are attempting to make. If you had read all of my post, you should have been introduced to that point but right now, I'm guessing you didn't read all of it.
(August 22, 2010 at 12:18 am)RAD Wrote: Thank you. That's where we completely disagree. At least one is irrational and wrong, unless of course you think truth is whatever you want to think it is. That wouldn't surprise me given the quantity of logical fallacies atheists use themselves. It would also explain why you haven't discovered the Way, the Truth and the Life.I know I can understand the nature of the universe better by going by what I see, hear, touch, taste, and smell than by inventing a reason purely from my imagination based on my ignorance of the truth.
More to the point, however, you haven't said, done, or proven anything to the extent that you have provided any level of 'truth' to anything you've attempted to prove here.
What I've done here is merely point that out to you.
If today you can take a thing like evolution and make it a crime to teach in the public schools, tomorrow you can make it a crime to teach it in the private schools and next year you can make it a crime to teach it to the hustings or in the church. At the next session you may ban books and the newspapers...
Ignorance and fanaticism are ever busy and need feeding. Always feeding and gloating for more. Today it is the public school teachers; tomorrow the private. The next day the preachers and the lecturers, the magazines, the books, the newspapers. After a while, Your Honor, it is the setting of man against man and creed against creed until with flying banners and beating drums we are marching backward to the glorious ages of the sixteenth centry when bigots lighted fagots to burn the men who dared to bring any intelligence and enlightenment and culture to the human mind. ~Clarence Darrow, at the Scopes Monkey Trial, 1925
Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first. ~Ronald Reagan
Ignorance and fanaticism are ever busy and need feeding. Always feeding and gloating for more. Today it is the public school teachers; tomorrow the private. The next day the preachers and the lecturers, the magazines, the books, the newspapers. After a while, Your Honor, it is the setting of man against man and creed against creed until with flying banners and beating drums we are marching backward to the glorious ages of the sixteenth centry when bigots lighted fagots to burn the men who dared to bring any intelligence and enlightenment and culture to the human mind. ~Clarence Darrow, at the Scopes Monkey Trial, 1925
Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first. ~Ronald Reagan