RE: Evidence god does not exist
August 31, 2010 at 6:36 pm
(This post was last modified: August 31, 2010 at 6:39 pm by Captain Scarlet.)
Take a look around you. There is an entire world out there. It is objective and external. Hidden God what now?
- I agree the world is objcetive, existence exists. I do not see how this responds to the point that if god was trying to be an external benchmark then why remain hidden?
What do you mean 'your god'? I do hope you're not assuming things about my beliefs. Then again, I'm almost certain you are.
- Not sure what you are getting at. You have a god, I don't; hence your god?!?
How do I know? Well, certain experiences have lead me to believe that there is an external force/intelligence/moral guide acting upon this universe in such a way as to benefit humanity as much as possible. These are charactertistics usually attributed to a god.If it isn't a god, then tell me, what do you think it is?
- I am not making a knowledge claim but you are, you need to establish how you know its god. I don't need to provide evidence it isn't. Huge burden for the theist making the claim, in this case yourself. Otherwise it remains baseless mystcism.
There is no way of proving through material means that there is an immaterial us, so anatomical stdies have no baring whatsoever here. Do you realize how complex and intricate the brain's design is? It is far more vast than we could ever hope to fully comprehend, and no amount of research could explain all of why the brain does what it does.Besides this, the body is usually considered a mere shell for the spirit, so suggesting that,(granted a spirit does exist) once the body dies, the spirit moves on, is not at all unreasonable. You just have to consider the characteristics of a spirit.
- But this is indistinguishable from magic. I could assert that science could not detect the immaterial leprachauns that really are us. On the other hand if there is an immaterial us that survives death, then if you expect us to go to an afterlife (I guess one nice one nasty experience) surely our identity is preserved in the spirit. If not then whats the point of survivng death, if it is how do you explain that brain damage in certain sections of the brain almost always leads to identity and personality changes. For this reasons Dualism (separate souls from bodies) is not a prevalent thesis amongst philosphers. A simpler explanation is that the mind and brain are connected and there is no soul or spirit
No I do not. In each case, I have assertions based on the experience of myself and countless others. Sound, rational people who are not in any way deluded throughout their daily life. Except, according to you, when it comes to God.
- I am not saying people who have experience aren't sound and rational. Where did you get that from? It is rational to believe in a god if you subscribe to certain worldviews , and you'll be positively disposed to find god in the universe (whether actually or by inference). Doesn't mean those worldviews are true. We all I'm afraid suffer from delusions (usually about our own importance!). However any assertions from experience are flawed by there nature. Even if every single christian had exactly the same experience at excatly the same time, that would be about 1/3 of the worlds population. Hindu experiences of Ginesh are equally as valid to the individual, but like your and others say nothing for a truth claim about Ginesh or other god/s.
but in each case there is evidence leading to a more satisfying and simpler conclusions.
Such as?
- Mind brain connection v. dualism and the existence of the spirit above
The evidence supports atheism being true or at least more likely. Not the way I see it.
- You don't see it is I do.
Take a look around you. There is an entire world out there. It is objective and external. Hidden God what now?
- I agree the world is objcetive, existence exists. I do not see how this responds to the point that if god was trying to be an external benchmark then why remain hidden?
What do you mean 'your god'? I do hope you're not assuming things about my beliefs. Then again, I'm almost certain you are.
- Not sure what you are getting at. You have a god, I don't; hence your god?!?
How do I know? Well, certain experiences have lead me to believe that there is an external force/intelligence/moral guide acting upon this universe in such a way as to benefit humanity as much as possible. These are charactertistics usually attributed to a god.If it isn't a god, then tell me, what do you think it is?
- I am not making a knowledge claim but you are, you need to establish how you know its god. I don't need to provide evidence it isn't. Huge burden for the theist making the claim, in this case yourself. Otherwise it remains baseless mystcism.
There is no way of proving through material means that there is an immaterial us, so anatomical stdies have no baring whatsoever here. Do you realize how complex and intricate the brain's design is? It is far more vast than we could ever hope to fully comprehend, and no amount of research could explain all of why the brain does what it does.Besides this, the body is usually considered a mere shell for the spirit, so suggesting that,(granted a spirit does exist) once the body dies, the spirit moves on, is not at all unreasonable. You just have to consider the characteristics of a spirit.
- But this is indistinguishable from magic. I could assert that science could not detect the immaterial leprachauns that really are us. On the other hand if there is an immaterial us that survives death, then if you expect us to go to an afterlife (I guess one nice one nasty experience) surely our identity is preserved in the spirit. If not then whats the point of survivng death, if it is how do you explain that brain damage in certain sections of the brain almost always leads to identity and personality changes. For this reasons Dualism (separate souls from bodies) is not a prevalent thesis amongst philosphers. A simpler explanation is that the mind and brain are connected and there is no soul or spirit
No I do not. In each case, I have assertions based on the experience of myself and countless others. Sound, rational people who are not in any way deluded throughout their daily life. Except, according to you, when it comes to God.
- I am not saying people who have experience aren't sound and rational. Where did you get that from? It is rational to believe in a god if you subscribe to certain worldviews , and you'll be positively disposed to find god in the universe (whether actually or by inference). Doesn't mean those worldviews are true. We all I'm afraid suffer from delusions (usually about our own importance!). However any assertions from experience are flawed by there nature. Even if every single christian had exactly the same experience at excatly the same time, that would be about 1/3 of the worlds population. Hindu experiences of Ginesh are equally as valid to the individual, but like your and others say nothing for a truth claim about Ginesh or other god/s.
but in each case there is evidence leading to a more satisfying and simpler conclusions.
Such as?
- Mind brain connection v. dualism and the existence of the spirit above
The evidence supports atheism being true or at least more likely. Not the way I see it.
- You don't see it is as I do.
- I agree the world is objcetive, existence exists. I do not see how this responds to the point that if god was trying to be an external benchmark then why remain hidden?
What do you mean 'your god'? I do hope you're not assuming things about my beliefs. Then again, I'm almost certain you are.
- Not sure what you are getting at. You have a god, I don't; hence your god?!?
How do I know? Well, certain experiences have lead me to believe that there is an external force/intelligence/moral guide acting upon this universe in such a way as to benefit humanity as much as possible. These are charactertistics usually attributed to a god.If it isn't a god, then tell me, what do you think it is?
- I am not making a knowledge claim but you are, you need to establish how you know its god. I don't need to provide evidence it isn't. Huge burden for the theist making the claim, in this case yourself. Otherwise it remains baseless mystcism.
There is no way of proving through material means that there is an immaterial us, so anatomical stdies have no baring whatsoever here. Do you realize how complex and intricate the brain's design is? It is far more vast than we could ever hope to fully comprehend, and no amount of research could explain all of why the brain does what it does.Besides this, the body is usually considered a mere shell for the spirit, so suggesting that,(granted a spirit does exist) once the body dies, the spirit moves on, is not at all unreasonable. You just have to consider the characteristics of a spirit.
- But this is indistinguishable from magic. I could assert that science could not detect the immaterial leprachauns that really are us. On the other hand if there is an immaterial us that survives death, then if you expect us to go to an afterlife (I guess one nice one nasty experience) surely our identity is preserved in the spirit. If not then whats the point of survivng death, if it is how do you explain that brain damage in certain sections of the brain almost always leads to identity and personality changes. For this reasons Dualism (separate souls from bodies) is not a prevalent thesis amongst philosphers. A simpler explanation is that the mind and brain are connected and there is no soul or spirit
No I do not. In each case, I have assertions based on the experience of myself and countless others. Sound, rational people who are not in any way deluded throughout their daily life. Except, according to you, when it comes to God.
- I am not saying people who have experience aren't sound and rational. Where did you get that from? It is rational to believe in a god if you subscribe to certain worldviews , and you'll be positively disposed to find god in the universe (whether actually or by inference). Doesn't mean those worldviews are true. We all I'm afraid suffer from delusions (usually about our own importance!). However any assertions from experience are flawed by there nature. Even if every single christian had exactly the same experience at excatly the same time, that would be about 1/3 of the worlds population. Hindu experiences of Ginesh are equally as valid to the individual, but like your and others say nothing for a truth claim about Ginesh or other god/s.
but in each case there is evidence leading to a more satisfying and simpler conclusions.
Such as?
- Mind brain connection v. dualism and the existence of the spirit above
The evidence supports atheism being true or at least more likely. Not the way I see it.
- You don't see it is I do.
Take a look around you. There is an entire world out there. It is objective and external. Hidden God what now?
- I agree the world is objcetive, existence exists. I do not see how this responds to the point that if god was trying to be an external benchmark then why remain hidden?
What do you mean 'your god'? I do hope you're not assuming things about my beliefs. Then again, I'm almost certain you are.
- Not sure what you are getting at. You have a god, I don't; hence your god?!?
How do I know? Well, certain experiences have lead me to believe that there is an external force/intelligence/moral guide acting upon this universe in such a way as to benefit humanity as much as possible. These are charactertistics usually attributed to a god.If it isn't a god, then tell me, what do you think it is?
- I am not making a knowledge claim but you are, you need to establish how you know its god. I don't need to provide evidence it isn't. Huge burden for the theist making the claim, in this case yourself. Otherwise it remains baseless mystcism.
There is no way of proving through material means that there is an immaterial us, so anatomical stdies have no baring whatsoever here. Do you realize how complex and intricate the brain's design is? It is far more vast than we could ever hope to fully comprehend, and no amount of research could explain all of why the brain does what it does.Besides this, the body is usually considered a mere shell for the spirit, so suggesting that,(granted a spirit does exist) once the body dies, the spirit moves on, is not at all unreasonable. You just have to consider the characteristics of a spirit.
- But this is indistinguishable from magic. I could assert that science could not detect the immaterial leprachauns that really are us. On the other hand if there is an immaterial us that survives death, then if you expect us to go to an afterlife (I guess one nice one nasty experience) surely our identity is preserved in the spirit. If not then whats the point of survivng death, if it is how do you explain that brain damage in certain sections of the brain almost always leads to identity and personality changes. For this reasons Dualism (separate souls from bodies) is not a prevalent thesis amongst philosphers. A simpler explanation is that the mind and brain are connected and there is no soul or spirit
No I do not. In each case, I have assertions based on the experience of myself and countless others. Sound, rational people who are not in any way deluded throughout their daily life. Except, according to you, when it comes to God.
- I am not saying people who have experience aren't sound and rational. Where did you get that from? It is rational to believe in a god if you subscribe to certain worldviews , and you'll be positively disposed to find god in the universe (whether actually or by inference). Doesn't mean those worldviews are true. We all I'm afraid suffer from delusions (usually about our own importance!). However any assertions from experience are flawed by there nature. Even if every single christian had exactly the same experience at excatly the same time, that would be about 1/3 of the worlds population. Hindu experiences of Ginesh are equally as valid to the individual, but like your and others say nothing for a truth claim about Ginesh or other god/s.
but in each case there is evidence leading to a more satisfying and simpler conclusions.
Such as?
- Mind brain connection v. dualism and the existence of the spirit above
The evidence supports atheism being true or at least more likely. Not the way I see it.
- You don't see it is as I do.
"I still say a church steeple with a lightning rod on top shows a lack of confidence"...Doug McLeod.
