(April 10, 2015 at 12:54 am)MysticKnight Wrote:Quote:If God can make sexiness arbitrary, he can make beauty arbitrary. If god can make beauty arbitrary, he can make (wait for it .......) goodness arbitrary.That doesn't seem to follow.
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You are saying if God can make anything arbitrary like how we physically look, he can make goodness arbitrary, but there is nothing to support this premise. I also say while physical beauty might be arbitrary to each species, the same is not true of INWARD objective beauty, which is God himself.
Bold mine. What I said was your argument for an objective quality X fails when God can make it arbitrary. Sexiness is a subset of beauty. Sexiness only exist in minds, just like beauty and goodness. Then there is two possibilities,
1) your argument for an objective sexiness is invalid making the whole set (beauty) also invalid. The concepts of beauty and goodness have exactly the same properties. If the argument for objective beauty is invalid, then so is the argument for objective goodness.
2) Your god cannot make any quality that exist in the mind arbitrary.
Quote:Quote:Ah, we praise and condemn the same way we always do.
I don't think you are getting the problem. You are defining it as simply what is helpful to society. That has no substance of praise and condemnation. To praise people to a degree or condemn them to a degree takes belief that there is objective goodness.
I don't buy your premise. The belief someone did something good is the only requirement to praise someone. That "good" can be something that is harmful to society like someone helping a robber. The robber will praise that person for helping him steal.
Quote:Quote:I'm pointing out that concepts cannot be eternal since they depend on minds. Concepts only exist in minds. If all the minds are gone, all the concepts are gone. A mind can apply a concept to any time period. So if I apply my standard of beauty to the 17th century, that doesn't mean my standard of beauty existed in the 17th century. Application of a concept does not mean existence of that concept in that time period.
So which premise do you deny now? Denying an Eternal mind is just attacking the conclusion, but the premises lead to the conclusion, so which premise do you dispute?
Denying that objective goodness/beauty/sexiness is eternal.