'Pulling the rug' from under the feet of "peacecful believers"?

[Ben Davis]

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People often say how much they hate terrorism and are always wanting believers to condemn terrorism. Many amoungst us Kathir claim to support "peaceful believers", reformers even, such as those at the Quilliam Foundation, and I'm guilty of this myself, but then say the killers are the only ones who are following the Quran properly. Do you think this is 'pulling any (metaphorical) rugs' from under the feet of anybody? This is an accusation I've heard.

I would say given that, yes, ISIS are following the Quran properly this is an excellent advert for Atheism. Sure, the majority of those dying in the fight against ISIS are Muhammadans, but they are Kurds (secular) and Shia, in particular those from Mr. Assad's Alawite branch (who make up about 10% of Syria's population) and any supported by those evil Iranians who may not be so evil after all. Shias and Kurds have to fight ISIS else they will die as they wouldn't survive in the Caliphate. Whereas, I'm sure many Sunnis, in particular in Iraq and Syria where Sunnis have been fighting Shia for years now, in the area quietly sympathize with ISIS even if they don't overtly support them.

Sure, I want to try and get along with these "peaceful believers" and, sure, the government needs to protect people against hate crime but I don't think being intellectually honest is pulling any rugs from under the feet of the "peaceful believers", do you? The believes need to stop denying the content that's in the Quran. Believers need realize that the Quran is arguably as bad as the Old Testament in terms of violence. Each time I turn a new page in my Quran I'm worried about what concerning verses I'll find next.

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Hi, I don't think we've had a discussion before so pleased to meet you.

You used the term 'following... properly' but the I think the term 'following a valid/justified interpretation' is more appropriate. As we're all aware, there can be many different, sometimes competing interpretations of any religion so there's value in asking believers to justify their beliefs and explain the parts of doctrine that support them. That gives insight as to how they validate their actions and makes it more difficult for followers of the same religion, who have different interpretations, to avoid group-responsibility for actions of fellow believers.

So I don't see it as 'pulling the rug...' either, more as showing the followers of a specific religion that they need to accept responsibility for the actions of some of its adherents when a 'valid' interpretation is claimed. When believers cry 'No True Scotsman!' or 'You're pulling the rug...', I see it as an attempt to avoid the responsibility they have to address the actions of their group or at very least, to accept that the interpretation is valid in terms of the overall religious doctrine. As we've seen, sometimes the response is to try to eradicate believers with alternative interpretations.

Looking specifically at Islam, here in the UK, muslims tend to follow a more 'enlightened', moderate, peaceful set of interpretations and the major Islamic bodies (The Islamic Council UK, the Muslim Council of Britain), who represent the majority of UK muslims, take a public stand against violent, extremist, fundamentalist or jihadist interpretations. However many of the fundamental views of muslims are shared across all interpretations and by making those shared views explicit, by demanding that believers validate/justify their interpretations, those outside Islam are able to illustrate why further change is necessary for the good of all.

Of course, I'm assuming that the religion is capable of such change, and justifiably so. Think of the ways Christianity has changed. After all, the effects of a religion rely completely on the actions of its believers and its fundamentals are no more that the accepted doctrines. Even Islam has been amended over time, the hadiths are a demonstration that Islam can change and the modern acceptance of what Salman Rushdie called 'the Satanic Verses' as dismissable sections of the Qur'an show that even the core text can have entire sections removed from fundamental doctrine. There will likely be more violence as this change occurs, even Christianity didn't change quietly, and that change will have to root from believers showing that they don't want to live the way that certain interpretations of Islam require. It seems that the best we can do is support the 'peaceful' believers in order to reduce the amount of harm that comes from Islams eventual transition.