RE: "My God, Why Hast Thou Forsaken Me?" Was Jesus Really Sinless?
May 3, 2015 at 5:18 pm
(This post was last modified: May 3, 2015 at 6:05 pm by Rhondazvous.)
(May 1, 2015 at 9:08 pm)Jenny A Wrote: The orthodox view of Jesus is that he was eternal with god and descended to earth as a human for a while. But Paul and the gospels all show signs of non-orthodox views of Jesus, or proto orthodox views if you like. These include:
Jesus was a man adopted and exulted by god to divine status. This would be the exaltation or adoptionist Christology. The adoption occurred- either at baptism, or at crucifixion, take your pick.
Jesus was god on earth and created by god at birth, but still fully human.
Jesus was god on earth in the semblence of a human. The gnostics held that view.
Jesus was a man inhabited by god (probably during baptism) who died at crucifixion when god left him. Some Gnostics held this view as well. The Jesus who says, "My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me," is this later idea of the human Jesus deserted by the spirit of god at death.
If you look at the texts concerning the baptism of Jesus, you will notice that with the exception of the earliest Mark, they all grapple a little with whether Jesus ever sinned. Baptism was supposed to be a purification of sin by moral superior, yet Jesus was baptized so his baptism is problematic, if he's supposed to be sinless. Each of the gospels handles this problem differently. They also reveal different ideas about the divinity of Jesus revealed in what god says at the baptism and when he says it.
So the biblical jury is still out. Odd that Jesus caan commit sins and still be seen as sinless, while we can live an exemplary life and still be seen as sinners.
(May 2, 2015 at 2:52 am)robvalue Wrote: My opinion is that the titular quote was overlooked and left in during one of the many ret-cons, that being the new idea that Jesus was actually God and not just his son.
Editing was shit back then, we have divine evidence of that. Not even God could tell a story straight.
My understanding is that it was common practice among the Romans to elevate men to god status, just like they still do today when they canonize saints.
I have read hundreds, perhaps thousands of books in my life, but I've never read any book written by humans with as many contradictions and errors and misquotes ass I find in the Bible. That millions of otherwise intelligent people believe it is the word of god betrays its chthonic origins.
The god who allows children to be raped out of respect for the free will choice of the rapist, but punishes gay men for engaging in mutually consensual sex couldn't possibly be responsible for an intelligently designed universe.
I may defend your right to free speech, but i won't help you pass out flyers.
Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.
--Voltaire
Nietzsche isn't dead. How do I know he lives? He lives in my mind.
I may defend your right to free speech, but i won't help you pass out flyers.
Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.
--Voltaire
Nietzsche isn't dead. How do I know he lives? He lives in my mind.


