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Animal Slavery
#97
RE: Animal Slavery
(April 2, 2014 at 7:23 am)alpha male Wrote:
(April 1, 2014 at 10:54 am)rasetsu Wrote: Actually, you haven't gotten to justifications yet. You need to show first that animal suffering and animals generally have moral significance. If they don't, no justification is necessary.
OK. Humans are animals, and God needs no justification for his treatment of us.
Indeed. From his point of view, he may be perfectly moral. From our point of view, he is neither moral nor immoral. He's just a thing. A thing to be opposed. God is not good. His commands are not moral.

(April 2, 2014 at 7:23 am)alpha male Wrote:
(April 1, 2014 at 10:54 am)rasetsu Wrote: That's where the evolutionary argument comes from, from arguments with vegetarians and animal rights advocates who mount an argument from ignorance that a moral division between how we treat animals and how we treat humans cannot be made. My argument shows that it can be made, so the advocate is put in the position of bearing the burden of proving that the lives of animals has moral significance.
Science debates whether the unit of selection for biological evolution is the ... species. From what I've read, the gene and the individual are considered to be much more significant than the species. So, no, you haven't shown that your argument can be made.
You've admitted the argument can and is made in science. What you debate is how good an argument it is. It need not be a good argument to deflate the opposing notion that no argument can be made.
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Messages In This Thread
Animal Slavery - by John V - March 26, 2014 at 12:57 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by No_God - March 26, 2014 at 1:02 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Esquilax - March 26, 2014 at 1:08 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 26, 2014 at 1:20 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Esquilax - March 26, 2014 at 1:23 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 26, 2014 at 1:50 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Esquilax - March 26, 2014 at 1:58 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 26, 2014 at 2:18 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Fidel_Castronaut - March 26, 2014 at 2:56 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Little Rik - March 27, 2014 at 7:09 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Fidel_Castronaut - March 27, 2014 at 7:17 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Little Rik - March 27, 2014 at 7:27 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Fidel_Castronaut - March 27, 2014 at 8:19 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Tonus - March 26, 2014 at 1:09 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Minimalist - March 26, 2014 at 1:28 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Losty - March 26, 2014 at 1:37 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by KUSA - March 26, 2014 at 1:40 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 26, 2014 at 1:49 pm
Animal Slavery - by Rampant.A.I. - March 26, 2014 at 1:42 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by No_God - March 26, 2014 at 1:44 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Lemonvariable72 - March 26, 2014 at 1:49 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by paulpablo - March 26, 2014 at 1:57 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Tonus - March 26, 2014 at 1:50 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 26, 2014 at 1:54 pm
Animal Slavery - by Rampant.A.I. - March 26, 2014 at 1:51 pm
Animal Slavery - by Rampant.A.I. - March 26, 2014 at 1:57 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Tonus - March 26, 2014 at 2:03 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by truthBtold - March 26, 2014 at 6:37 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by No_God - March 26, 2014 at 1:58 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 26, 2014 at 3:08 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by sven - March 26, 2014 at 6:50 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 27, 2014 at 7:28 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by sven - March 27, 2014 at 8:56 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - March 26, 2014 at 2:00 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Minimalist - March 26, 2014 at 2:07 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by sven - March 26, 2014 at 2:28 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Tonus - March 26, 2014 at 2:45 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by sven - March 26, 2014 at 2:53 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Kayenneh - March 26, 2014 at 2:58 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Minimalist - March 26, 2014 at 3:08 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Cato - March 26, 2014 at 4:08 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Doggey75 - March 26, 2014 at 4:29 pm
Re: RE: Animal Slavery - by KUSA - March 26, 2014 at 4:50 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - March 26, 2014 at 5:09 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - March 26, 2014 at 7:12 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - March 26, 2014 at 10:21 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by KUSA - March 26, 2014 at 6:07 pm
Animal Slavery - by Rampant.A.I. - March 26, 2014 at 7:26 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Rahul - March 26, 2014 at 7:47 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Heywood - March 26, 2014 at 11:32 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Fidel_Castronaut - March 27, 2014 at 3:57 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Heywood - March 27, 2014 at 4:57 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Fidel_Castronaut - March 27, 2014 at 6:20 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by My imaginary friend is GOD - March 26, 2014 at 11:16 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - March 27, 2014 at 5:16 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by My imaginary friend is GOD - March 28, 2014 at 2:58 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 28, 2014 at 7:14 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Rahul - March 28, 2014 at 7:43 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 28, 2014 at 8:00 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Tonus - March 30, 2014 at 10:47 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 30, 2014 at 10:58 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by truthBtold - March 30, 2014 at 11:12 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Tonus - March 28, 2014 at 7:55 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - March 28, 2014 at 2:11 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 28, 2014 at 2:30 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - March 28, 2014 at 3:21 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - March 30, 2014 at 9:22 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - March 30, 2014 at 11:30 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - April 1, 2014 at 7:37 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - April 1, 2014 at 10:54 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - April 2, 2014 at 7:23 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - April 2, 2014 at 10:40 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - April 2, 2014 at 11:45 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by James2014 - April 2, 2014 at 12:36 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - April 2, 2014 at 12:56 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by James2014 - April 2, 2014 at 2:00 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - April 2, 2014 at 2:35 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by James2014 - April 2, 2014 at 4:39 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by My imaginary friend is GOD - March 28, 2014 at 7:18 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by My imaginary friend is GOD - March 28, 2014 at 7:57 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by ShaMan - March 28, 2014 at 2:29 pm
Animal Slavery - by Rampant.A.I. - March 28, 2014 at 3:28 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - March 28, 2014 at 6:27 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - March 28, 2014 at 7:29 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - March 28, 2014 at 10:21 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by sven - March 29, 2014 at 9:21 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - March 29, 2014 at 11:44 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by sven - March 29, 2014 at 5:29 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - March 29, 2014 at 12:09 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - March 29, 2014 at 5:02 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - March 29, 2014 at 5:22 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - March 29, 2014 at 5:30 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by ShaMan - March 28, 2014 at 8:13 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Rahul - March 28, 2014 at 8:23 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by LastPoet - March 29, 2014 at 5:12 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - March 29, 2014 at 5:26 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by LastPoet - March 29, 2014 at 5:37 pm
Animal Slavery - by Rampant.A.I. - March 29, 2014 at 5:33 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - March 29, 2014 at 5:49 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - March 29, 2014 at 5:56 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by LastPoet - March 29, 2014 at 5:34 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by sven - March 29, 2014 at 5:54 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - March 29, 2014 at 6:04 pm
Animal Slavery - by Rampant.A.I. - April 2, 2014 at 12:23 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Fromper - April 2, 2014 at 6:06 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by Angrboda - April 2, 2014 at 9:56 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - April 3, 2014 at 7:34 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by Fromper - April 3, 2014 at 10:10 am
RE: Animal Slavery - by bennyboy - April 3, 2014 at 5:23 pm
RE: Animal Slavery - by John V - April 3, 2014 at 7:02 pm

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