(July 24, 2013 at 10:57 pm)bladevalant546 Wrote: Okay, let put it in perspective and maybe we can stop using personal emotions that were taught when we were mentality vulnerable to influence. Also from political (obviously) motivations, with little regard to what is actually the issue. Let us put away our religious, or philosophical lenses and look at abortion.
I used to be "pro-life" until I studied some basic facts about fetal development and realized there's no there, there (i.e. no brain so no being so no right to life) until about week 21. Last statistics I saw revealed that over 90% of abortions occur within the first trimester, well before this time. I admitted I was wrong and moved to the other camp. So thank you for your speech on open-mindedness but, in my case, it's not needed.
Confronted with the fact that they're protecting the life of a mindless collection of cells, the so-called "pro-lifers" will fall back to the "under construction" argument. Since the advocates for this position are fond of strict definitions, can we agree that "not yet = no"? It doesn't yet have a brain. So it isn't yet a being. So it's not a being. So it has no right to life. There's no person there.
Additionally, I've already exposed that this is not about "right to life" at all. The reality that most "pro-lifers" would "allow" abortion in the case of rape only proves that point.
If you people REALLY believed that this unborn was a living being with rights to life, then how can you sentence it to death for the crimes of its father?
How morally bankrupt is that?
This is not about "pro-life". This is about pro-I-want-to-wag-my-finger-at-the-'Jezabel'-who-had-what-I-think-had-'irresponsible'-or-'immoral'-sex-and-tell-her-'honey-you-made-your-bed-so-you-now-lie-in-it'. Just be honest with yourselves and with others and admit it already. Well, hey, if you want to preach at the "harlots", that's what soap boxes and the first amendment are for. Tell it on the mountain but don't tell it on Capitol Hill.
And I suppose you so-called pro-lifers never realized just how complex the issue is? You do no there are all kinds of conditions under which abortion might occur outside of the "Jezebel" scenario that you're so fond of? How about the mother who's egg implanted in her Fallopian Tube, threatening her life and making her expectant child non-viable? She's probably already distraught over losing her child under this tragic condition. The last thing she needs is one of you idiots yelling at her as she goes to have the necessary operation to save her life. How about the still borne that needs to be "cleaned out" before it become gangrenous? You think she needs a lecture from the Catholic crusader types camped outside the clinic?
Now for those of you would would be so magnanimous as to "allow" abortion under these medically needed conditions, how is a patient supposed to get them with zealots bombing clinics and state representatives playing doctor by closing clinics down through needless regulations?
And how is the rape victim to get an abortion again? Even if the clinics stay open, how do we determine if she does qualify for one of the conditions under which you would "allow" it? Do we take her word on it? If so, then every woman wanting a choice in the matter can just claim she was raped by an unknown assailant. Or do we wait for a conviction? What if there's an appeal to that conviction? How many months does the court take to try a rape trial again?
The laws we have on the books now protect the fetus roughly around the time period you are concerned with. After week 24, you can't just pop into the local abortion clinic and announce you've changed your mind. Only when the mother's life is in danger is it allowed under these conditions.
And finally, just to repeat:
No brain = no being = no right to life. Q.E.D.
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist