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RE: Argument against atheism
December 19, 2011 at 1:16 am
In case the OP wasn't paying attention. This ...
(December 19, 2011 at 12:04 am)Faith No More Wrote: I have read no such argument from you, just merely an attempt to redefine 'god' as something more palatable than the bearded man in the sky. And if objective morality becomes the standard for god's existence, consider him debunked, because you have not proven there is any such thing.
What is your evidence that morality is anything but a human construct, and can you demonstrate what the standard for morality would be?
... is what we have been trying to tell you for the last eleven pages.
Your original "argument" is not an argument at all, it is a list of claims, and it falls flat on its face on the first claim examined.
Please show us how you came to the conclusion that objective morality exists.
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RE: Argument against atheism
December 19, 2011 at 1:18 am
On the first day of xmas, a theist sent to me,
a dodo in a cedar tree.
Everyone now!
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RE: Argument against atheism
December 19, 2011 at 1:18 am
(December 18, 2011 at 11:05 pm)aleialoura Wrote: You should also note that 1,500 animal species have homosexual tendencies.
So homosexuality must be a primary function of the universe, right?
Just like word-salad.
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RE: Argument against atheism
December 19, 2011 at 1:19 am
Alright KichigalNeko I will try this again. Just explain to me how what I said is mental masturbation and verbaldiahorrea... I mean everyone on here is claiming that my argument is crap, but no one is offering any explanation for how or why that is the case.
IS atheism a lack of belief actually? or is atheism just another word invented by humans to describe a certain neurochemical brain-state? to believe that in reality atheism actually IS real at all apart from subjective experiences necessitates a belief in what would most correctly be termed "God". I don't know how many times i need to say it before one of you just shuts me up by explaining how I am wrong about that. It seems you are against God simply because humanity has decided to name it God. You don't need to call it God. You can call it whatever you like. that's not the point. the point is a belief that anything is objectively true, a belief for which there is and will never be any empirical evidence, must stem from a belief in something that would correctly be called God.
Again, if one doesn't believe that things are objectively true or real, that is fine, i just don't think that science would agree, and it seems to me illogical.
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RE: Argument against atheism
December 19, 2011 at 1:21 am
Amkerman, you started your premise by misstating what atheism is, and you never recovered, as is here evinced by your need to play rhetorical with Kichi's point, as well as your continued verbal spew on what seeming is. You need a theory of knowledge course.
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RE: Argument against atheism
December 19, 2011 at 1:22 am
(This post was last modified: December 19, 2011 at 1:25 am by thesummerqueen.)
Now we're getting somewhere, except you're going to have to split that up.
Are we going to discuss if things are objectively real, or if things are objectively true?
one of my favorite moments in AF chat:
Quote:<Ryft> "What is real" is metaphysics. "How we know" is epistemology. They are categorically different issues.
<DoubtVsFaith> Ok, well, do you believe reality exists separate to our subjective experience?
<Ryft> Do I believe things are objectively real? Yes.
<DoubtVsFaith> So if no one is experiencing a rock, say, it doesn't stop existing, right?
<Ryft> Correct.
<DoubtVsFaith> So why do you believe that things still exist when they are not experienced?
<Ryft> Because I have a metaphysics that defines reality in that way.
<thesummerqueen> [bland tone] Just because a woman hasn't experienced an orgasm doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
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RE: Argument against atheism
December 19, 2011 at 1:26 am
(This post was last modified: December 19, 2011 at 1:30 am by The Grand Nudger.)
If you send me a $20 bucks I'll be $20 bucks richer, objectively and truthfully. This is what I believe. I'll send you a picture of me, spending your $20 on whiskey. You can sign it and everything, just to be certain. So I guess things like that can be established by emprical evidence after all. Now, whereabouts in my fleecing you for drinking money is a belief in god "necessitated"?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Argument against atheism
December 19, 2011 at 1:30 am
Money is the ultimate myth made reality. No god can touch its power, so they all covet it.
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RE: Argument against atheism
December 19, 2011 at 1:33 am
They are thee same summer queen. Something that is real is necessarily true.
epimethean: no, i am not playing rhetorical with Kichi's point. I am stating the only thing I have been saying since the beginning. Kichi's claim that atheism is actually a real thing is the entire point of my argument. If you don't believe anything is objectively real, which is a wholly rational yet illogical belief to have in my opinion, that's fine. But a belief that anything actually is objectively true or real, which is a claim for which there is absolutely no empirical evidence or data, necessarily must stem from a belief in something that would most correctly be termed as a monotheistic deity.
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RE: Argument against atheism
December 19, 2011 at 1:36 am
(December 19, 2011 at 1:19 am)amkerman Wrote: Alright KichigalNeko I will try this again. Just explain to me how what I said is mental masturbation and verbaldiahorrea... I mean everyone on here is claiming that my argument is crap, but no one is offering any explanation for how or why that is the case.
Wow. Just wow. You have really mastered the art of selective reading to perfection!
There is no argument to refute, just claims (which we rejected on the first page of this thread). I said ...
(December 18, 2011 at 3:31 pm)Darwinning Wrote: I'm sorry, but I simply see no reason to believe in absolute moral values (actually, I see more evidence to the contrary). I think that kind of breaks your argument, doesn't it?
Please could you be so kind as to back up your claims, instead of reiterating them over and over again?
I have a plane to catch, so take your time. I'll read your wonderful exposition of of evidence for the existence of objective morality later.
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