Book of Acts: Pure Fantasy

[brotherlylove]

So I trust you understand now. Do you believe that mortals can work magic?

I believe that God can do miracles through those who have received His Holy Spirit. It isn't a power from man, it is the power of God through man.

...or any evidence that they ever happened at all at any time.

You just lost 30 credibility points. You're not off to a good start.

I've asked you to explain WHY miracles happened like crazy back then but it's all quiet today.

You say it's all quiet today. I've met many people who claimed to be healed of various conditions, and I have no reason to believe they are lying. I've read countless reports and heard countless testimonies. There are thousands and thousands all over the internet. Why do you think it is so implausible that God is acting in the world?

I don't understand this justification at all. Why does a megalomaniacal attention-hungry god of the Bible suddenly want to hide his power? You treat this as if it's a given but actually this is a paradox that needs to be explained.

He hides His power to the extent that He doesn't openly reveal Himself to the world, like writing His name in the sky. What He gives us is general revelation and special revelation instead:

Romans 1:20

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

The general revelation of God is through His Creation, which is something you have apparently picked up on. The special revelation is through Jesus Christ.

A god who punishes unbelief with eternal torture can't be considered one that values "free will" much.

You don't go to hell because of unbelief, you go to hell because of sin. You have free will to accept or reject His offer of forgiveness for your sin and receive eternal life.

Without coercion? Without coercion? I'm channeling Hitchens here. Did you really write "without undue coercion"? A religion that threatens non-belief with eternal torture isn't coercion? A religion that intrudes in all areas of life, from schools to the law isn't coercion?

You don't believe it, do you? So how are you coerced? A person who doesn't believe in God isn't going to feel coerced into belief because they aren't afraid of God. A person who does believe in God might think about it, but still aren't going to believe it. Only a person who firmly convinced about the truth of Jesus Christ is going to believe it. Some people might become Christian for fire insurance, but most believe because they have come to know the love of God.

Correct. Cough up hard evidence (not just testimony) or it's summarily dismissed as bullshit.

What do you consider hard evidence? A video? I'm not sure how I would prove a miracle to you.

And so if everyone is delusional why aren't you delusional for believing in a supernatural creation of the Universe?

My "deist beliefs" are limited to the sense of awe about the natural universe, the perception that it is a grand machine, and thus there is some sort of mysterious mind behind it, "God" for lack of a better word. God could hypothetically supernaturally intervene but MERE MORTALS CAN'T.

So why couldn't He hypothetically intervene through mere mortals? If He can do anything, why not that?

The Big Bang is a moment of Creation of the universe as we currently know it, whatever may have existed before that. There is a chasm of difference between speculating about whether or not there was a mind behind this event and claiming MERE MORTALS can work sorcery.

There is no difference at all. The supernatural is the supernatural. You either believe it or you don't, and apparently you believe it.

---

I've seen many reports from skeptics and (now) ex-atheists. How do you explain them?

Do you know how many fucking xtian assholes we get here claiming they were "atheists" ( they usually spell it wrong) until they "saw the light," or "god spoke to them," or "jesus jerked them off?" You are as phony as they are, pal.

As has been noted above, evidence or it didn't happen. You fuckers lie too much.

How am I supposed to prove that I was once a nonbeliever? It's not really that important if you believe it or not, but it's the truth.

Oh, and nice to meet you btw.

[Forsaken]

You don't go to hell because of unbelief, you go to hell because of sin. You have free will to accept or reject His offer of forgiveness for your sin and receive eternal life.

For a millionth time, its not freewill. Its dictatorship...

[brotherlylove]

You don't go to hell because of unbelief, you go to hell because of sin. You have free will to accept or reject His offer of forgiveness for your sin and receive eternal life.

For a millionth time, its not freewill. Its dictatorship...

Hey God is sovereign over His Creation; He is the Lord of Lords, the authority of the authority. But, it is not an autocratic government, it is a theocratic government. We do have free will; we are not robots and you can choose to disobey God. No one ever said it was wise.

[Forsaken]

you can choose to disobey God.

Why the torment in hell then if you have the choice? you used the privilege god gave you, simple as that!

[Minimalist]

How am I supposed to prove that I was once a nonbeliever?

Let's be clear about something just so there are no misunderstandings. I don't care. I've already written you off as just another bible-thumping fool and, for the record, I think you're full of shit.

[Forsaken]

[quote='Minimalist' pid='234947' dateline='1328236617']

I think you're full of shit.

holy shit!

[KichigaiNeko]

I've already written you off as just another bible-thumping {insert favourite book of fairy stories here} fool and, for the record, I think you're full of shit.

Seems to be my sentiments as well lately Min. Has someone left out the "Loonies are welcome" mat AGAIN!!??!?

[brotherlylove]

you can choose to disobey God.

Why the torment in hell then if you have the choice? you used the privilege god gave you, simple as that!

You have the choice to disobey God much like you have the choice to walk out into traffic. No one said it was wise.

Yes, it is the priviledge God gave you, it doesn't give you less of a choice. According to the secular worldview, for instance, all of your actions and thoughts were predetermined by the arrangement of molecules at the beginning of the big bang. So actually, free will could only come from God.

---

How am I supposed to prove that I was once a nonbeliever?

Let's be clear about something just so there are no misunderstandings. I don't care. I've already written you off as just another bible-thumping fool and, for the record, I think you're full of shit.

Well, before God I am telling the truth. How about you? Were you ever a believer?

[frankiej]

According to the secular worldview, for instance, all of your actions and thoughts were predetermined by the arrangement of molecules at the beginning of the big bang. So actually, free will could only come from God.

*turns gun on myself*

[brotherlylove]

According to the secular worldview, for instance, all of your actions and thoughts were predetermined by the arrangement of molecules at the beginning of the big bang. So actually, free will could only come from God.

*turns gun on myself*

Don't do it! We have to have to talk about science first.