Syrian civil war, conclusions and solutions

[cratehorus]

I do believe Turkey should invade Syria.

I beleive NATO should invade

Turkey to me is the bright shining star of the middle east.

We must not be talking about the same middle east

It`s a secular Republic, it`s constitution and laws are not made on the basis of religious texts, it`s economic groath is amazing, it`s human rights issues (although still existing) are getting less by the year

you could say the same about Iran

and it has abolished the death penalty.

so does Cambodia and Rwanda, don't you find it strange a country that once had mandatory death panalties for dozens of crimes will just "abolish" the death penalty one fine sunday morning??

I was thrilled when Recep Erdogan, who is a islamist, spoke at thair square after the egyptian revolution and clearly said that what egypt needs now is not a religious state but a secular republic.

Why? lol.......... is the german media telling people erdogan is the main reason the arab spring didn't result in muslim theocracy?

In the current syrian conflict, the hole left, when no one supported the rebells was filled with Saudi money and Saudi idiology. The place is fludded with salafists of the worst kind.

That's just SAUDI'S............ being Saudi's, muslims know how Saudi's act (most travel there once a year after all)there's plenty of money, and guns coming from everywhere, anyway.

To make things eaven worse the conflict has changed, from a conflict wich was about deposing a tyrant to a secterian\ethnical conflict; sunis, shias, alawites, salafists, kurds, christains are currently fighting each other or with each other.

I don't see this at all? there has always been a conflict against the Alawites because they're the ruling class, and a self-declared master race.

Eaven if Assad will be deposed I fear a Youguslavia war scenaro, in wich the most powerfull faction will start massacring the smaller weaker ones.

absolutely not, if it didn't happen in Egypt then it wont happen in Syria, you can't compare yugoslavia to anything....... yugoslavia is special

So eaven if Assad is deposed, a foreign military mission would probably be necessery to prevent a reigniting conflict between ethnicities and sects.

agreed, but which one, the Turks are no better equipped than Suadi Arabia or Isreal, for that matter.

Why Turkey? First of, because it can. It is a Nato member, therefor has modern military equiptment. It has been fighting insurgents for years aswell as training for a possible war with greece - therefor is expirienced.

"new member" of NATO. turkey looks nice, but it's people are still as hate filled as they were during the war....... and why are yhey training to fight greece, btw?

Second turkish troops wouldn`t be met with as much resistance as western troops.

not true if anything it would be worse, turks are neighbors they have just as much unreasonable hatred, for their neighbors, as your people do, for your wonderful neighbors in Poland

third Turkey as a secular Republic would be a great rolemodel for the middle east.

yeah a 99% muslim nation doesn't have much of a need to wory about secularism, also "secular state" doesn't mean much Liberia, and Kazakhstan are secular as well

I believe the argument, that we would help islamists by not intercepting is invalid, since the islamist salafists would get power anyway when Assad is deposed, and if Assad remains in power he will be nothing but a pupet of islamist Iran.

most people who rant about the islamist salfists taking over don't care about the conflict and would just as soon nuke all of Syria as their "final solution" you know the one they've been trained from birth to believe in

Anyway, not that I think it will happen, but the best way for the FSA to stop this war is to attack this building http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_nav..._in_Tartus it's very unlikely, it would be destroyed without bloodshed, but it would force NATO to kill assad

[Something completely different]

Anyone who wants cheap resources. Gas companies? Not one of those people. America? Depending on them.

ähhh american oil companies did get contracts in Irak, but not most of them. actualy their share isn`t as big considering the fact that they invaded them.
the contracts for the five biggest oil fields went to:
Dutch Shell, Chinese National Petroleom Corporation, Malaya Petronas, Norway Statoil, Russia Lukoil, Italian Eni, Exxon Mobil, Haliburton and BP.

The real winner of the third gulf war was Iran, wich now has a shia ally in the region.

so eaven if the US-Bush,Chenney administration wanted oil - they eaven failed at that.

[Violet]

ähhh american oil companies did get contracts in Irak, but not most of them. actualy their share isn`t as big considering the fact that they invaded them.
the contracts for the five biggest oil fields went to:
Dutch Shell, Chinese National Petroleom Corporation, Malaya Petronas, Norway Statoil, Russia Lukoil, Italian Eni, Exxon Mobil, Haliburton and BP.

The real winner of the third gulf war was Iran, wich now has a shia ally in the region.

so eaven if the US-Bush,Chenney administration wanted oil - they eaven failed at that.

Yes, and they failed at it by not simply taking control of the region as a US territory.

You've cited a perfect example of invading without annexing, and you'll notice they've been entrenched in an impossible guerilla war since?

We've the most powerful military in the world, and we spend the most in the world on maintaining it and making it even stronger... So why not use the damn thing properly? It's too large to be of particular use in defense (waste of resources, inefficient), and it's large enough to at the very least take and hold Canada

[Something completely different]

We must not be talking about the same middle east

when making a list of what might be the best democracies in the middle east Turkey is certainly number 2 after Israel.

you could say the same about Iran

NO! Turkey defines itself as the Republic of Turkey, Iran defines itself as the Islamic Republic of Iran. Turkeys Head of State is a President, Irans head of state is a old backwards religious scholar-the ayatola who has the last word in whatever the goverment might propose and who is not elected - wich makes Iran a Theocracy

so does Cambodia and Rwanda, don't you find it strange a country that once had mandatory death panalties for dozens of crimes will just "abolish" the death penalty one fine sunday morning??

They abolished the death penalty to rise their chances to become EU member, and also put their courts under the survailance and juristiction european court for human rights.

Why? lol.......... is the german media telling people erdogan is the main reason the arab spring didn't result in muslim theocracy?

well since we live nearer to the missle east and our media attention doesn`t focus entirely on what israel might do, I do believe I have a better picture of what`s going on.
The muslim brotherhood actualy critzised Erdoan after his visit, because he proposed egypt to become secular

That's just SAUDI'S............ being Saudi's, muslims know how Saudi's act (most travel there once a year after all)there's plenty of money, and guns coming from everywhere, anyway.

I dont get your point? are you saing only because they spread islamist fashism with weapons and bombs doesn`t mean that we have to stop them? i dont think your saying that but if yeah , well it`s nuts!

I don't see this at all? there has always been a conflict against the Alawites because they're the ruling class, and a self-declared master race.

the alawites have clearly tried to break up aliences between sects and ethnicities. the kurds are currently more interested in authonomy in the nort than in the rest of the war, the alawite pose as the protectors of the christian minority, so yes - ethnical or and secticious conflict is possible.

absolutely not, if it didn't happen in Egypt then it wont happen in Syria, you can't compare yugoslavia to anything....... yugoslavia is special

egypt is not a multicultural country - syria is.
no one can actualy compare historic events since they are all unique.
But one can give examples of similar situations.
Youguslavia was a multicultural nation and when the ruling ethnicitie gradualy lost power it turned to ethnicaly cleansing all other minorities, just like the other ethnicities

not true if anything it would be worse, turks are neighbors they have just as much unreasonable hatred, for their neighbors, as your people do, for your wonderful neighbors in Poland

you might be right on that, i forgot that syria once was under brutal ottoman rule.
and the poles love us now so .... you and godwins law!

yeah a 99% muslim nation doesn't have much of a need to wory about secularism, also "secular state" doesn't mean much Liberia, and Kazakhstan are secular as well

Libera isn`t mayority muslim and Kazakhstan isn`t a democracy.
so whats your point?

most people who rant about the islamist salfists taking over don't care about the conflict and would just as soon nuke all of Syria as their "final solution" you know the one they've been trained from birth to believe in

again. .... you and godwins law!
BREAKING NEWS!!! nazi germany has seized to exist 68 years ago!
and i never claimed that i wanted to nuke all of syria. i just stated that it is the west own fault that salafists are taking over, because of their inaction

Anyway, not that I think it will happen, but the best way for the FSA to stop this war is to attack this building http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_nav..._in_Tartus it's very unlikely, it would be destroyed without bloodshed, but it would force NATO to kill assad

why? wouldn`t it then be more likely that putin drops bombs on northern syria to end the FSA?

[Brian37]

I`ll start by asking should Turkey put an end to the Assad regime using it`s army?

I don't think they will, but it sure would be helpful to the west and take a little bite out of the stupid dominionist accusations of the east. The only problem with any enterial or regional beef in that area, isn't that some dictator might get toppled, but what will they be replaced with.

I am more hopeful for Libya and Egypt but even those are not given at this point.

[Haydn2]

Cival war is democracy in its extemist sense . The election of war will favour the most popular.

[Polaris]

Stop funding the rebels.

Why?

Because they are murderers no better (actually slightly worse) than the Syrian government.

[Angrboda]

Is that a real country? Cause it sounds like something you just made up.

[KichigaiNeko]

The Turks are nothing more than opportunists...they'll invade

[Faith No More]

Because they are murderers no better (actually slightly worse) than the Syrian government.

How would you propose a country go through a civil war? Killing is quite often a necessary part of deposing a leader. Should they sit down together in front of a campfire playing Eucher to see who gets what? These things are messy, but it can be very necessary to implement a regime change. There's a good chance that blood will be spilled.