new thread for old RE: Atheists, what do you believe is the best argument for the existence of a deity?

[Mark 13:13]

Dreams don't seem to me to be particularly supernatural........let me offer something in return.

On patrol in some terrible and non-descript part of th world I opened fire on a phantom target that seemed to be circling me (and mine) at o-dark thirty that I couldn't actually see( despite my anpvs). I'm not the only one who experienced this, other joes also opened fire, none of us had any trouble pointing our weapons, we all experienced this.

As far as we can tell......there was never anything there at all - but no single one of us will accept that we didn't hear and see -something-. Still, I can't confidently claim the supernatural......but you're willing to do so on something so innocuous as dream?

nope.

I was working night duty on a ward just after midnight on the normal routine of clearing previous days paperwork and putting fresh forms at patients beds. It was a nightingale style (warehouse type) two rows beds except for 2 small rooms near centre that where partitioned of as special precaution infection control rooms. It had a matching ward on the other side of corridor which was female. I never had any problems on the ward before but I started to experience what I call the heebee jebees, nervousness as I got closer and closer to the empty siderooms. I finished the forms and the feeling went. I said nothing to anybody but next night as I was getting the handover from the day staff they told me A patient of ours a younger patient than our usual (a young man) had told them he got a bit of a fright as he was opposite the side room and he thought he saw an old lady go into the sideroom, he went to show her back to the ladies ward but when he got there there was no one there. The exact same room that had given me the heebee jeebees the same night....

nothing on its own just another constant stream....

[Cyberman]

I had a very disturbing dream where I dreamed I was watching the TV when the programe broke for a news flash about a crashing plane. The TV was showing the events from a news helicopter flying close and the plane had a part of its fusilage missing and people were being sucked out of a large hole in the fusilage as the plane continued to fly along. The camera crew were so close I could see the face of a passenger and hear their screams as they got pulled out of the plane and flew threw the air. I was not just upset by the film but was more upset by the tv crew as I felt that the public needed to know the news but it could have been done in such a way as to protect the dignity of the victims and allow them to die with some privacy from public gaze.... thought no more until a few days later the radio described a similar event and people being sucked out of plane as I ate my breakfast.

nothing on its own but part of a string of events that kept me aware that there is more to our existence than we know

This one actually happened to me today - well, more yesterday actually. To give a bit of context: for many months now I have been in the practise of meeting my very good friend Shell at a local bus stop - since she now lives out of town - two or three times a week, whereupon we spend a few hours catching up, putting the world to rights, or simply crying on each others' shoulder. Basically each helping the other through our own personal shit.

Well, I was due to meet her as usual yesterday, though because of communication issues to do with unreliable mobile networks, I had no idea whether this was still happening or if so, what time etc. That morning I had a vivid dream in which she'd come into town, saw me not standing there at the stop, and thus came to the flat. She's sensitive to my intermittent nervous state, so on the very odd and increasingly rare occasion she's done this, she's always knocked gently at the door rather than use our charming cuckoo-impersonating doorbell. This, in my dream, is what she did. So far a boring dream, I grant you; it did liven up immensely afterwards, but that's hardly suitable for this part of the forum. Anyway...

Some time later, I woke up and recalled the dream, which made me check my 'phone for messages. There were none. While I nodded, nearly napping, suddenly there came a tapping, as of some one gently rapping, rapping at my chamber front door. Yes, it was indeed Shell, the events of my dream had played themselves out precisely as I remember them. Coincidence? Probably. After all, how many times might I have dreamed similar things and not had them play out (eg, the later parts of yesterday's dream )?

[Norfolk And Chance]

Best argument for the existence of a deity?

Well if I thought that there was any sort of argument whatsoever, let alone a "best one", then I'd be a theist wouldn't I?

[Baalzebutt]

Isn't it a bit odd that those who have personal experiences with god somehow always experience the god that they were brought up with? If ANY god were real, and personal experiences with said god were encountered, wouldn't it make sense that at least a few of the people he granted personal experiences to would be of a faith other than that of the god? Wouldn't that be at least a bit more of a testament to his existence?

Oh wait...I am making a logical, rreasonable argument there. Please forgive me.

[Surtr]

Isn't it a bit odd that those who have personal experiences with god somehow always experience the god that they were brought up with? If ANY god were real, and personal experiences with said god were encountered, wouldn't it make sense that at least a few of the people he granted personal experiences to would be of a faith other than that of the god? Wouldn't that be at least a bit more of a testament to his existence?

Oh wait...I am making a logical, rreasonable argument there. Please forgive me.

The majority of them are. But trust me, if you go on youtube, you'll find tons of Christian videos gloating over Muslims converting to Christianity.

[ThomM]

RE: Atheists, what do you believe is the best argument for the existence of a deity?
........

WHen I was much younger - the reason why I believed in a god - was because mom told me to.

She also told me to believe in the Tooth Fairy - and Santa Claus.

However - beyond indoctrination without reason - there has NEVER been any good argument for the existence of a "supernatural god". All of them are never testable or repeatable.