Quite a shame how people respond

[little_monkey]

It's been abused, overused to the point it can mean anything you want. There was a time, yep I'm that old, when the word was rarely used, and when it was used, people paid attention. Today, it's just background noise. Or it just means that the user lacks imagination in transmitting a better message.

I think there's an upside to that. It's one of those words that, when you think about it, shouldn't really make people cringe on its own. It's really just an exclamation with no real force by itself. Call someone "a stupid fuck" and they'll take more exception to the word "fuck" than to the word "stupid," even though the real insult is that you're calling them stupid. Doesn't make sense.

It's even worse when you get comedians who think that just saying the words is funny enough. "Politics? What the fuck is up with that??? (laughter)" <-- if you're telling that joke on a stage, I hope it's because it's amateur night and you had a few too many drinks.

I agree with that. But my point was one of strategy. If you are sending a message to some people, or whatever the audience is, and you know that such words are going to be a distraction to these people, then it's just like shooting yourself in the foot.

[Rayaan]

Just look what happened to the F-word: it's fucking horrible; it's fucking beautiful; last night, I fucking freaking out; get the fuck out of here; go fuck yourself; blah, blah, blah...

It's been abused, overused to the point it can mean anything you want. There was a time, yep I'm that old, when the word was rarely used, and when it was used, people paid attention. Today, it's just background noise. Or it just means that the user lacks imagination in transmitting a better message.

Those examples are not personal attacks, though, except for the last two.

I agree with you that in the past maybe the F word was not used as much as it is used today. However, there were certainly other ways of insulting people aside from just the F word as it is today, some which are even much more offensive.

Like anything else, I think the important thing is to consider the context of that word, the way it is worded, how they say it, how often they it, and why they say it.

I also say the F word sometimes when I get really pissed at something, although I've never said it to anyone. The only time I say it is when no one is around to hear me say it, something like "this fucking shit" or "fucking ridiculous" or whatever and I think I say it just to get out the anger and/or frustration out of me. But, whenever I'm interacting with others, like on a public forum, for example, I don't like to use unnecessary, negative words in my replies and especially not swear words. Maybe a little bit here and there, but not in such an emotional way like others tend to do.

Also, having spent some years on a few Islamic forums, and having moderated one of them, I know that using the F word - even if it's not used as a personal attack - is likely to get you banned from there. Actually, you can't even write that because most of the common swear words automatically get censored when you post them.

So, after coming to this forum, I noticed that people were using more swear words here than in the other forums that I've been to. I thought they were bad people or something. But, later, that wasn't a big deal for me since I slowly adjusted myself to a new audience and a different use of language.

Users of the F word lack imagination? Well, maybe, but I don't think there is a strong connection behind that.

[little_monkey]

Just look what happened to the F-word: it's fucking horrible; it's fucking beautiful; last night, I fucking freaking out; get the fuck out of here; go fuck yourself; blah, blah, blah...

It's been abused, overused to the point it can mean anything you want. There was a time, yep I'm that old, when the word was rarely used, and when it was used, people paid attention. Today, it's just background noise. Or it just means that the user lacks imagination in transmitting a better message.

Those examples are not personal attacks, though, except for the last two.

I agree with you that in the past maybe the F word was not used as much as it is used today. However, there were certainly other ways of insulting people aside from just the F word as it is today, some which are even much more offensive.

Like anything else, I think the important thing is to consider the context of that word, the way it is worded, how they say it, how often they it, and why they say it.

I also say the F word sometimes when I get really pissed at something, although I've never said it to anyone. The only time I say it is when no one is around to hear me say it, something like "this fucking shit" or "fucking ridiculous" or whatever and I think I say it just to get out the anger and/or frustration out of me. But, whenever I'm interacting with others, like on a public forum, for example, I don't like to use unnecessary, negative words in my replies and especially not swear words. Maybe a little bit here and there, but not in such an emotional way like others tend to do.

Also, having spent some years on a few Islamic forums, and having moderated one of them, I know that using the F word - even if it's not used as a personal attack - is likely to get you banned from there. Actually, you can't even write that because most of the common swear words automatically get censored when you post them.

So, after coming to this forum, I noticed that people were using more swear words here than in the other forums that I've been to. I thought they were bad people or something. But, later, that wasn't a big deal for me since I slowly adjusted myself to a new audience and a different use of language.

Users of the F word lack imagination? Well, maybe, but I don't think there is a strong connection behind that.

It's pretty much what I was saying. If it is a distraction, then your message will be lost on your audience. On this forum, it isn't. But on most sites, and everyday life, more often than not, it is.

[Tonus]

I agree with that. But my point was one of strategy. If you are sending a message to some people, or whatever the audience is, and you know that such words are going to be a distraction to these people, then it's just like shooting yourself in the foot.

I'm willing to be civil with someone who I know will try to engage me in an honest and genuine manner, because it seems like the polite thing to do. In that case, it's a person that isn't going to create a distraction if I use crude language, but who may lose interest in the discussion. In that case, use of foul language might have the effect you describe, and I think we're poorer for it.

On the other hand, I admit that I'm less concerned with people thinking I'm mean because I treated an idiot like an idiot.

[Rayaan]

It's pretty much what I was saying. If it is a distraction, then your message will be lost on your audience. On this forum, it isn't. But on most sites, and everyday life, more often than not, it is.

And remember that there are many other ways of causing distraction.

Even if we eliminated swear words, people can get very underhanded and crafty in delivering insults to their opponents. One famous example of that in history is Cicero, considered one of Rome's greatest orators, whose letters and speeches were so persuasive and yet so verbally demeaning and abusive that one lady (Antony's wife Fluvia), upon Cicero's death, pulled out his tongue and stabbed it repeatedly with her hairpin because of the anger she felt at the horribly nasty things he used to say about her husband.

Psychologically, it's true that words sometimes do have a powerful impact on others; same thing with blasphemous words.

I think that whenever a person joins a group, like when they join a forum, for example, they seek to get a feeling of 'belonging' and 'accepted' in that community (and maybe that is something that is hardwired in all of us, to a certain extent). But, when they get insulted (or hear some swear words thrown at them), they start to feel the opposite of what they expected to feel when they came here ... and then ... well, you know what happens.

So, indeed, sometimes words are like daggers, as the expression goes - but, again, that ultimately depends on the person. Different people react to insults differently. Telling someone "Hey, man, this is just the freaking internet! Why the fuck should you give a damn about what people say on the internet?" is not always going to work, although it never harms to try it. I've said that myself.

[fr0d0]

Go back and read the whole thing again, Frods. It was definitely about blasphemy.

I'll take your word for it sweetness ;)

[thesummerqueen]

^ that's the point I was trying to make. Why should "this is useless" be more valuable than "this is shit"?

They mean the same thing.

The response people make is purely due to the woo factor given to the words, and on a forum where policy isn't being made and guns aren't involved, I'm not going to hold my tongue to keep from offending people's petty insecurities.

---

Rayaan's post, not fr0d0's, that is.

[The Grand Nudger]

Ah, but one is delivered with style and emotion. "This is useless shit" would be even better, double down to emphasize that it's a useless example from a useless set....

[Rayaan]

^ that's the point I was trying to make. Why should "this is useless" be more valuable than "this is shit"?

They mean the same thing.

They mean the same thing, yes, but they are not are exactly the same.

"This is useless" < "This is shit" < "This is bullshit" < "This is a fucload of shit" < "This is a fuckload of bullshit" .... and so on (in terms of emotion).

[fr0d0]

My personal history was heavily influenced by my peer group who swore profusely. Now i find i can't express emotion strongly without swearing. My parents didn't really swear, and neither do a lot of folk i know. It has always been a mark of respect for me not to swear. Funny that i joined a church where swearing is voluntarily outlawed. I guess it's possible to train yourself not to. I think i was somewhat successful lol :p