The Case for Atheism

[Asmodee]

There is 0

One is the loneliest number.

Two can be as bad as one.

It's the loneliest number since the number one.

Every time I see your name go by I think you're angry at me.

[chris(tnt)rhol]

I'll bite.

The only reason TO believe in a supernatural creator is "because someone says so". Think about that. How did you come to believe. Because your parents told you it was true? Your pastor? The Bible? I can tell you how you DIDN'T come to believe. You DIDN'T come to believe by contemplating observations from the world around you, figuring out that a god does exist and what his properties are and coming to the independent realization that this god exists, only to find out later that there was a religion which held those exact same beliefs.

If you take away the Bible (or whatever your holy book of preference) and all personal references to religion, would you believe? Would you be able to come to the exact same conclusions you now hold if someone didn't first tell you what you needed to believe? Or do you have to first know the answer, and only THEN can you find the evidence to support it? Because in all of recorded history the approach of learning the answer first and looking for data to support that answer later has NEVER worked. When you're looking for "truth" you can't start with an answer. If you do then you're not looking for truth at all, you're looking for validation. So, if the world were exactly as it is today with the one exception that nobody had ever had a concept of a god of any sort, there were not god beliefs, no holy books, no religions, would you be able to look around you and come to the conclusion that your god, specifically, exists? The answer, of course, is no.

Wanted to join this thread. Read a bit. Its very long. Too long so ill just reply to this post and see where it goes.

You appear to be using your reactions to the questions of gods existence. To justify a consensus that everyone would reaction the same way.

I believe in god not because I was told to but because I believe that I can feel the presence of god. God himself says that his attributes are invisible, he will only reveal himself if he chooses. 1+1, hence why faith is a huge concept within Christianity. The outside world and all its marvel compel me to reason further, the creator and creation.

So my experience differs from yours respectfully.

The bible is the word of god (obviously written by many authors, similar to a ghost writer (s), do you think frank zappa actually wrote his autobiography? )

Now your next question is about authority and being taught. One could reason, without being taught, how would one know anything (think mother and baby).

Being told what to look for, then looking for it and then finding it sounds very familiar.

Without a standard to measure against. How would you know ugly from beauty? Bad from right? Left from right???

Are you comparing knowing the answer, god, from knowing like the answer to pi?

I think we should discuss your answer no and exactly what that relates to.

[Cyberman]

If the bible is the word of "God", why doesn't it contain information that could not have been known at the time, let alone information that was known yet somehow eluded the book's authors? I'm referring primarily to the 'creation' accounts in Genesis, which we know to be factually incorrect - the Sun came before the Earth, stars are not little lights attached to the sky etc.

[Fidel_Castronaut]

The bible is the word of god...

I'd like to see some hard evidence about that if possible please?

[SteelCurtain]

The bible is the word of god...

I'd like to see some hard evidence about that if possible please?

Ummm... the Bible says so, F_C.

[Elskidor]

The bible is the word of god because the bible says it is the word of god, because the bible is the word of god because the bible says it's the word of god, because the bible is the word of god because the bible says it's the word of god, because the bible is the word of god because the bible says it's the word of god, because the bible is the word of god because the bible says it's the word of god!!

EVIDENCE!


BTW, Final Fantasy VI is the best Final Fantasy because I said it is, so there. Do not doubt me. Only doubt your own opinion if it differs from me.

[Esquilax]

I believe in god not because I was told to but because I believe that I can feel the presence of god.

And every muslim can feel the presence of Allah, so what? If I really truly feel the presence of Elvis, does that mean Elvis is really alive, or that I might be mistaking what I'm feeling?

God himself says that his attributes are invisible, he will only reveal himself if he chooses

Well, I'm sure that's very convenient for the people who profit from religion, then.

The outside world and all its marvel compel me to reason further, the creator and creation.

Without any evidence that specifically points to a creator, marveling at nature is just an argument from personal incredulity.

The bible is the word of god (obviously written by many authors, similar to a ghost writer (s), do you think frank zappa actually wrote his autobiography? )

Proof plz.

Now your next question is about authority and being taught. One could reason, without being taught, how would one know anything (think mother and baby).

Uh, if that were the only way to know things, every single discovery ever made in the history of humanity would not have happened. Powered flight, for example, was not known about because we were taught it, but because of observations about the way physics and aerodynamics works. Which is also the rebuttal to your claim: we can know things by observing the world and extrapolating from what we find.

Without a standard to measure against. How would you know ugly from beauty? Bad from right? Left from right???

The first and second are evolved traits that deal with out survival. The last is a conceptual label added to two directions relative to individual human beings to aid in communication. That was easy.

Why do you assume the only standard is god's?

[Mudhammam]

I believe that I can feel the presence of god.

That's impressive! Please do tell! (Include details).

[bennyboy]

I believe in god not because I was told to but because I believe that I can feel the presence of god.

Ru-heally? And what does that feel like? Do your little toesies curl up? Do the hairs on the back of your neck stand up? Do you feel inexplicably inspired and filled with a warm comfortable, lobotmized feeling?

God himself says that his attributes are invisible, he will only reveal himself if he chooses.

You are so privileged that God talks to you. One time I thought God was talking to me, too, but it turns out I had just eaten ate some bad shrimp.

The bible is the word of god (obviously written by many authors, similar to a ghost writer (s), do you think frank zappa actually wrote his autobiography? )

The difference is that I can see pictures of Frank Zappa, and watch recordings of him. There are many things I have not seen-- the thundergod Thor, leprechauns, fairies, and unicorns. I haven't seen ghosts, goblins or gremlins.

Despite the fact that many people have written about all these things, I don't believe any of them are real. That's because I can't find their albums in my Dad's garage.

[Whateverist]

Yeah, that about covers it.

Re the OP: there is definitely evidence for the existence of atheism. This site alone harbors tons of them. The case for atheism is solid.