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Why do we need morals?
#51
RE: Why do we need morals?
I need a sense of morality to keep from exterminating those that deny the need for morality in society.
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#52
RE: Why do we need morals?
(May 12, 2013 at 9:00 am)dazzn Wrote: I think those who purport moral subjectivism only do so based on their own latent sociopathy, but I personally don't endorse "morality" at all.

Why should a grown and rational person do so?
Morality for me is just a fancy word for "feels right". Now, what "feels right" I believe is determined by the society we were brought up in and is ultimately the product of a lot of superstitions and dogma, Christian or otherwise. Thinking and reason can and will lead to different morals than those we have today, albeit of course only over the course of generations. Then what "feels right" will be more in sync with what our reasoning tells us is logical. What is "right" basically boils down to treating others as we would like to be treated ourselves. This is a sound rational basis because it is impossible to prove that my own desires and wants have any objective, reasonable precedence over the desires and wants of any other being.

Of course only when we are not in distress we have the capacity for moral action. When we are in distress reason breaks down (because it hasn't evolved for this purpose) and we will be selfish and do whatever necessary to survive. I would not say the latter is in the realm of "moral versus immoral".
"Men see clearly enough the barbarity of all ages — except their own!" — Ernest Crosby.
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#53
RE: Why do we need morals?
(May 20, 2013 at 6:02 am)littleendian Wrote:
(May 12, 2013 at 9:00 am)dazzn Wrote: I think those who purport moral subjectivism only do so based on their own latent sociopathy, but I personally don't endorse "morality" at all.

Why should a grown and rational person do so?
Morality for me is just a fancy word for "feels right". Now, what "feels right" I believe is determined by the society we were brought up in and is ultimately the product of a lot of superstitions and dogma, Christian or otherwise. Thinking and reason can and will lead to different morals than those we have today, albeit of course only over the course of generations. Then what "feels right" will be more in sync with what our reasoning tells us is logical. What is "right" basically boils down to treating others as we would like to be treated ourselves. This is a sound rational basis because it is impossible to prove that my own desires and wants have any objective, reasonable precedence over the desires and wants of any other being.

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#54
RE: Why do we need morals?
(May 21, 2013 at 4:15 am)apophenia Wrote: ....

[Image: um-what-the-fuck-thumb.jpg?w=580]
"Men see clearly enough the barbarity of all ages — except their own!" — Ernest Crosby.
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#55
RE: Why do we need morals?
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#56
RE: Why do we need morals?
(May 27, 2013 at 10:29 am)dazzn Wrote: I simply think the world would be better if people did as they pleased.

This is clearly not true as the scenario would rapidly descend into people doing as they please interfering with the ability of others to do as they please. Even our roads don't work like that. From the earliest days of motorised travel, drivers very quickly learned that, generally speaking, co-operation and consideration for other road users allows for everyone to get to their destinations with the minimum of inconvenience. Anyone want to tell the class what sort of scenario would inevitably ensue if everyone decided to abandon the rules of the road and decide just to 'do as they pleased'? I suspect the phrase "the world would be better" might not be included.
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist.  This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair.  Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second.  That means there's a situation vacant.'
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#57
RE: Why do we need morals?
(May 28, 2013 at 7:48 am)Stimbo Wrote:
(May 27, 2013 at 10:29 am)dazzn Wrote: I simply think the world would be better if people did as they pleased.

This is clearly not true as the scenario would rapidly descend into people doing as they please interfering with the ability of others to do as they please. Even our roads don't work like that. From the earliest days of motorised travel, drivers very quickly learned that, generally speaking, co-operation and consideration for other road users allows for everyone to get to their destinations with the minimum of inconvenience. Anyone want to tell the class what sort of scenario would inevitably ensue if everyone decided to abandon the rules of the road and decide just to 'do as they pleased'? I suspect the phrase "the world would be better" might not be included.

consideration is overrated. i doubt most hold it.
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#58
RE: Why do we need morals?
I am thinking that people pretty much "do as they please" now and cherry pick some apeal to authority to do so.
"The Universe is run by the complex interweaving of three elements: energy, matter, and enlightened self-interest." G'Kar-B5
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#59
RE: Why do we need morals?
(May 27, 2013 at 10:29 am)dazzn Wrote: I simply think the world would be better if people did as they pleased.
You seem to use the term "conscience" for things I would've perhaps hastily put under the term "morals". If your claim that "morals" don't exist is just an appeal for less reliance on "moral authorities" (religios or otherwise) and more reliance on our own "inner compass" then I'm all for that.
"Men see clearly enough the barbarity of all ages — except their own!" — Ernest Crosby.
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#60
RE: Why do we need morals?
(May 28, 2013 at 8:41 am)dazzn Wrote: consideration is overrated. i doubt most hold it.

And that's your entire response? Personal opinion?
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist.  This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair.  Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second.  That means there's a situation vacant.'
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