numerical mriacle.....again

[Faith No More]

I haven't read the calculations, but a Fibonacci sequence creates a ratio that ultimately progresses towards the golden ratio. Perhaps something similar is in play with no magic required.

[thequestion]

Most of these proclaimed "miracles" are actually quite likely to happen but the ones i presented arent at all.

That particular pattern is very unlikely. However finding some sort of pattern is not. If you look for patterns in random numbers you will also find them. There must be thousands of different patterns that one could look for. However normally with this stuff it is done the wrong way round. People add the numbers together in certain ways until they get a pattern. You will also find that almost every old document that exists has had the numerology treatment.

There was an even simpler more powerful pattern that you missed. The chapter numbers are each one greater than that of the last chapter. Perhaps the work of an all powerfull God...

thats exactly what i disagree with, there are not thousands of different pattern you could look for. It is quite limited and you might wanna define a pattern x or y to make it a specific pattern, but we would consider that to be absurd.

And i also agree that you might find patterns in every text, but not these ones, i consider them to be extremly unlikely to happen.

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Did you check the calculations yourself?
No credit awarded if you don't show all steps and partial results.

In a standard scientific report, there is a section on materials and methods which allows anyone with suitable background and resources to confirm or deny the conclusions of the experimenters.

In this case, I'm highly suspicious that there are errors in the unchecked results. It is a repeatedly observed phenomenon that the devout will slant/fabricate data in order to confirm their preferred conclusions. My default position is that this is what has occurred.

My time is too valuable to look for where the fudging took place. Even if this investigation was done honestly, the argument that coincidences happen is valid. A true positive result is only circumstantial evidence of supernatural intervention of any kind. After that you still have to show which god, devil or impersonal ectoplasmic instantiation did it.

All numbers are correct, your comment implies that you find this pattern also kind of "special", i might be wrong.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzTXNjGbavk he does it in front of your eyes and i also did both myself.

I do not understand why people really post things about the biblecode. The biblecode is not interesting, it would be intersting if you would not find any patterns or "prophecies" because the liklihood that these occur is very high.

And no, "you dont find patterns everywhere" .

[Cato]

thats exactly what i disagree with, there are not thousands of different pattern you could look for. It is quite limited and you might wanna define a pattern x or y to make it a specific pattern, but we would consider that to be absurd.

And i also agree that you might find patterns in every text, but not these ones, i consider them to be extremly unlikely to happen.

I gave you a process that results in far more than just a thousand patterns, almost all of which don't result in the golden ratio. You seem to intentionally be ignoring my argument.

[thequestion]

Numerology, what a fucking joke.

How many combinations of numbers, assigned by counting collections of characters, can be combined into sets and then dividend against one another that don't result in the golden ratio? This is always ignored.

A proper god would not require numerology to prove his/her existence. This argument makes your god come across as quite feeble.

How many sets can you create with the numbers of the quran. Of course almost infinitly many, but how many of these sets that would potentially fit the golden ratio when divided by each other would look like a nice pattern similarly to the one i presented? And how many of these sets would then also fit a symmetry, like the one presented ?

[pocaracas]

Son, I feel it's time I introduced you into ancient literature.
Here's a XVI century poem written by one man... a one-eyed man: Os Lusíadas
It was written in archaic portuguese, still mostly understood by the people, but with some nice flourishes.
But what I want to show you about this poem is this little quote from the wiki:

The poem consists of ten cantos, with a variable number of stanzas (1102 in total), written in the decasyllabic ottava rima, which has the rhyme scheme ABABABCC.

The poem is made up of four sections:

An introduction (proposition - presentation of the theme and heroes of the poem)
Invocation – a prayer to the Tágides, the nymphs of the river Tejo;
A dedication - (to D. Sebastião), followed by narration (the epic itself)
An epilogue, (beginning at Canto X, stanza 145).

The middle section contains the narration and a variety of scenes. The most important part of Os Lusíadas, the arrival in India, was placed at the point in the poem that divides the work according to the golden section at the beginning of Canto VII.

1102 stanzas ALL written with the same rhyme scheme, ALL verses decasyllabic! And still he manages to tell the story!
Portuguese is a rich language, but COME ON!!!
This requires some super-human wisdom to accomplish, don't you think? The man himself claims in the poem that he was assisted by the muses... must be true!

[ManMachine]

elaborate please

thank you

There is an entire field of study looking into numerical patterns in religious texts, this is not extraordinary, Jewish scholars have been using Gematria for centuries and found far more interesting things than the one you pointed out.

It's not interesting, not miraculous and plays directly into the functions of the human brain that have evolved to spot patterns. It's an evolved ability put to pointless use.

You're welcome.

MM

[thequestion]

elaborate please

thank you

There is an entire field of study looking into numerical patterns in religious texts, this is not extraordinary, Jewish scholars have been using Gematria for centuries and found far more interesting things than the one you pointed out.

It's not interesting, not miraculous and plays directly into the functions of the human brain that have evolved to spot patterns. It's an evolved ability put to pointless use.

You're welcome.

MM

show me one. the best/most impressive they have.
thank you


I am not familiar with the "rules" of peotry, but i thought keeping a good metre or rhyme scheme is not that difficult, i might be wrong.

[Mister Agenda]

I don't see any miracle.

The miracle is, that the odds of finding similiar straight forward patterns in a book are so low that it would be completly absurd to assume that this happened by chance. People at the time of the compilation had a lot different concerns than including patterns and it would have been difficult to do without a PC.

If one of them happens i could accept, that this is mere chance ( considering the article http://quranspotlight.wordpress.com/arti...-debunked/ ). But two of them, no way that this is only coincidence.

So, even i dont know what your definiton of "miracle" is, let me ask you this. Do you think, considering these two coincidences as a result of pure chance is absurd or not, and why?

thank you for your answer

Wouldn't you have to do a similar analysis of many other books before determining the results of analyzing this one are miraculous?

[Faith No More]

How many sets can you create with the numbers of the quran. Of course almost infinitly many, but how many of these sets that would potentially fit the golden ratio when divided by each other would look like a nice pattern similarly to the one i presented? And how many of these sets would then also fit a symmetry, like the one presented ?

The fact that there are so many infinite other sets is precisely the point. No matter what text you evaluate, you will be able to find an anomaly like this. That's why numerology is bullshit.

[thequestion]

How many sets can you create with the numbers of the quran. Of course almost infinitly many, but how many of these sets that would potentially fit the golden ratio when divided by each other would look like a nice pattern similarly to the one i presented? And how many of these sets would then also fit a symmetry, like the one presented ?

The fact that there are so many infinite other sets is precisely the point. No matter what text you evaluate, you will be able to find an anomaly like this. That's why numerology is bullshit.

how is this exactly the point, of coruse you can find many sets, and if you would claim a certain pattern because of them it would merely look totally absurd. So there is only a very limited amout of this huge amount of sets which would make a pattern look intersting/real/nice to humans.