Where are the Morals?

[paulpablo]

Harris wrote

Sex is such a potent sense that it may obscure all of your logic and rationality. The only way to stop sexual abuses is the use of force and fear. I am preparing something interesting on this topic and you will have full opportunity to give your critical opinion.

Ok but our definitions of what constitutes a sexual abuse might be different, and there's probably several grey areas where I don't know if I could judge what is and isn't a sexual abuse.

You possibly, among with other Muslims, view marriage at the age of 9 years old permissible if the girl shows signs of puberty, which in my opinion would be an abuse no matter what stage of puberty she is at.

I don't see homosexuality as a sexual abuse, you may do.

Also what I would do in a situation where I had a wife and she cheated on me, most likely would not be the right thing to do, it would just be the thing I would do in the heat of the moment.

So if I had a wife and I found her in bed with another man I'd want to beat the man to death (assuming I loved her very much), I'm sure in the history of crimes of passion this has happened quite often.
But I don't think this makes it right to introduce a nation wide law that men who get caught in bed with someones wife should legally be beaten to death.

But I'm looking forward to the question you want to ask.

[genkaus]

[DramaQueen]

Why are Muslims obsessed with sex?

Harris, don't you know that cousin marriage is more common amongst Muslims?

And do you like Zakir Naik?

[MusicLovingAtheist]

OP is probably a jihadist.

[bennyboy]

Why are Muslims obsessed with sex?

Because it gives them an excuse to talk about it, which is probably about as close to it as they are getting.

[Harris]

[Mudhammam]

Most of my responses are no more than two or three sentences long. However, how many queries and critiques you guys submit that many responses I am giving.

Person has a choice to believe in the existence of God or not. You have chosen not to believe. You can fashion your own justification to please and satisfy your own self and be happy with all that.

If your belief makes your behaviour aversive and arrogant then there is a defect somewhere in your belief system.

I admire your childlike simplicity. However, I'm truly confounded by your notion that a person chooses his or her beliefs about the reality that is fostered upon them. I didn't chose to disbelieve in God. I chose to consider the evidence pro and con and as a consequence, was forced to doubt the credibility of those arguments in favor of Its existence.

Harris Wrote: … “there was no law of nature that man should love mankind, and that, if there had been any love on earth hitherto, it was not owing to a natural law, but simply because men have believed in immortality. Ivan Fyodorovitch added in parenthesis that the whole natural law lies in that faith, and that if you were to destroy in mankind the belief in immortality, not only love but every living force maintaining the life of the world would at once be dried up. Moreover, nothing then would be immoral, everything would be lawful, even cannibalism. That’s not all. He ended by saying that for every individual, like ourselves, who does not believe in God or immortality, the moral law of nature must immediately be changed into the exact contrary of the former religious law, and that egoism, even to crime, must become not only lawful but even recognised as the inevitable, the most rational, even honourable outcome of his position.’”

Page 45 The Brothers Karamazov
Part 1, Book 2, Chapter 6 ("Why Is Such a Man Alive? ")
Fyodor Dostoevsky

More nonsense from dead authors.

Now Fyodor Dostoevsky is nonsense. By the way, he had told a great truth.

“who does not believe in God or immortality, the moral law of nature must immediately be changed into the exact contrary of the former religious law, and that egoism, even to crime, must become not only lawful but even recognised as the inevitable, the most rational, even honourable outcome of his position.”

You have totally abolished God and moral accountability from your life and this has automatically focused all your rationality to the loci of your pleasures seeking behaviour. You are blindly promoting prostitution, homosexuality, incest, fornication, and all other forms of illegal sex in the name of consensus. You have made homosexuality not only lawful but also inevitable, most rational, even honourable by superseding all health issues such as:

Fyodor Dostoevsky indeed spoke many great truths ("Rebellion" is one of the finest statements on the Problem of Evil that I've ever read) but again, you're simplistic understanding shines through when you confuse the views expressed by his fictional characters with a) his own views (which one can still rightly disagree with) and b) facts and/or generalizations about one person's POV as it relates to all of society. Then, of course, you falsely equate homosexuality with "pleasure seeking behavior," including, as you describe it, incest (Oh yeah? Care to tell us more?) and "all other forms of illegal sex," demonstrating that not only are you a dunce but also a douchebag.

[Esquilax]

[Harris]

[Aoi Magi]

Wow, this thread has some really long posts. Anyway

Can you disprove existence of God by using your REAL SCIENCE?

We don't disprove something which hasn't been proven in the first place.

If there is no God what else can justify existence of this Spatiotemporal Universe.

You can believe in an eternal god, but not an eternal universe?

"If you equate the probability of the birth of a bacteria cell to chance assembly of its atoms, eternity will not suffice to produce one...”

Quote mine? really? did you even bother to read the entire page where you copied that from?

Correct! Adam’s children were getting married together in order to spread human race on earth. There was no miracle and there was no evolution. That was the requirement then. However, neither Adam nor Eve were touching their off springs in obedience of God’s commandments.

You do know what 'incest' is right? And why it is bad to produce offsprings via incest let alone populate the entire world?

I repeat that anxiety arising out from adultery is a universal feeling and every normal person hate such feelings. For that reason, adultery is a crime and immoral act.

You do know that there are several tribes in Africa, who willingly exchange wives and husbands, and even some where the wife can belong to multiple husbands? So no, it is not a 'universal' feeling, rather it is how our modern societies have come to feel.

You also do know that quran and other religious texts support the idea of concubines and sex-slaves, right?

Rapist is a rapist because he has no guilt and threat of moral accountability. Rapist do not care about the existence of God at least at the time when he commits the rape. Therefore, rapist is atheist. I had never heard any case that someone raped in the name of Jesus.

Ah I didn't know you were a psychic able to read a rapists mind during a rape. Also raping in the name of jesus? You should really follow the news sometimes.

To help any starving person or give medicine to some sick person who cannot afford medicine for his cure due to whatsoever reason is not stupidity. Atheism kills conscience and pushes people to arrogance and barbarism.
You have no idea about empathy.

Helping the needy is not dependent on religion. People all over the world help those who are in need, irrespective of their faith or lack thereof.

On the other hand forcefully 'helping' those who don't want or need it, is one of the most prominent feature of abrahamic faith systems.