If

[Cyberman]

I'm more shocked that Dumbo replaced Sleepy. How come I missed that?

[Whateverist]

You have a sharp eye. I'm pretty sure there is supposed to be a Sleepy. Still, even so, I don't see why consciousness wouldn't be a product of the brain.

[Cyberman]

Well, I knew Dumbo was the elephant in the room. Then it was simply a matter of who was missing.

[psychoslice]

Consciousness is our true self, the mind body organism is what arises from Consciousness, we are not the mind body organism, we are in fact pure Consciousness, so after what we call death, there will be no you, that was only conditioning and programming, which is the ego. In reality there is no such thing as death, its just a transformation of energy, after our so called life, there is nothing but pure Consciousness, we as we were will not be there to say anything.

[DeadChannel]

I'd start screaming movie quotes at the top of my lungs. Just to keep the old fucker on his toes, yo.

[Little Rik]

In either case, natural or induced, circulation stops. Oxygen and other neutrients are no longer being supplied to the brain. How is the brain suppose to know that it is induced or not?

How the brain suppose to differentiate between feeling pain and not feeling pain?
Who told you that it is the brain role?
Get rid of your many dogmas mate.
http://jamie-monk.blogspot.com.au/2011/0...urite.html

Then it seems that you will never have the medical knowledge you wished. At least you do have a specialty, wishful thinking.

I wish so many things surgen but i also reach the stage in which i believe in priorities.
I just don't wish to be reborn again and again to chase hallucinations and delay the day i will merge in the ocean of bliss.
What about you?
Are you happy to live in a world in which there is no real progress?

LOL. Nobody is qualified. Do you know why? Because you lie the best to yourself. Hense, you cannot trust yourself to determine what is objectively true.

In a way nobody except God is really qualify but there are some people who are a bit more qualify than other.
If you never take any risk you never get anywhere.
By the way surgen, just ask you one small question.
When you find a beautiful person and you wish to kiss him-her do you ask a medical certificate that he-she doesn't have syphilis or AIDS or you go along and kiss?

There you go again putting the cart before the horse. You first have to prove that a spirits exist before you can claim a gland is its doorway. Do you even understand the duelist problem with this hypothesis? How is a physical thing suppose to interact with a spiritual thing? There has to be a mediator, what is the mediator?

I find the evidence when i do meditation.
By concentrating on a particular gland i feel that gland as the center of energy in that particular area but again it is by practicing that you may understand this point.

I'm not even sure what you're saying here. The brain has sections that control different aspects. All these sections do work together like a giant commitee. There is noone in charge, and everyone is kind of doing their own thing. However, they still talk to each other.

You still are far far away and in the middle of the big ocean and the shore is still far far away.
But as the old granny said.............it is never too late.......

Thosands of alien abduction testimonials that come to the same conclusion are no evidence. There not evidence for aliens because there are simple psycological explanations for each case. NDE's are in the same boat.

Are you saying that the atheists that had an NDE and no longer are atheists had all an hallucination?

First off, I never said they were lying. I said they were wrong. For someone to lie, they first have to know that what they're saying isn't true.
You can't seem to grasp the concept of the null hypothesis. The null hypothesis is always based on well known phenomena. The physical universe is a well known phenomena. Before you can propose newly discovered phenomena, you first have to show that the known ones cannot explain the observations. Then, you can create a falsifiable hypothesis that you test. So far, you haven't been able to do the first step. And the next step is impossible for you because your hypothesis is not falsifiable. Hense, it is not scientific.

Why don't you go to grab the ex atheists that after an NDE are now believing in God and bang them in the head until they admit that what they really had was just a big hallucination.
Go on surgen.

---

You have a sharp eye. I'm pretty sure there is supposed to be a Sleepy. Still, even so, I don't see why consciousness wouldn't be a product of the brain.

Your hard drive is just a storage of information.
Can this storage of information act by itself or it need you to start acting?
I guess you never thought about it whatever?
Did you?
Don't give up whatever.
One day you will get there.

[pocaracas]

You have a sharp eye. I'm pretty sure there is supposed to be a Sleepy. Still, even so, I don't see why consciousness wouldn't be a product of the brain.

Your hard drive is just a storage of information.
Can this storage of information act by itself or it need you to start acting?
I guess you never thought about it whatever?
Did you?
Don't give up whatever.
One day you will get there.

If you want to make an analogy, make a decent one.
Your Intel or AMD processor has some cache. It does processing and storing of temporary values... more permanent storage goes into RAM and even more permanent goes to the hard drive. A brain is all of these in one.... and then some!

[Surgenator]

In either case, natural or induced, circulation stops. Oxygen and other neutrients are no longer being supplied to the brain. How is the brain suppose to know that it is induced or not?

How the brain suppose to differentiate between feeling pain and not feeling pain?
Who told you that it is the brain role?
Get rid of your many dogmas mate.
http://jamie-monk.blogspot.com.au/2011/0...urite.html

How is the spirit suppose to differentiate between feeling pain or not feeling pain?
Who told you that it was the spirit's role?
Get rid of your many dogmas mate.
http://neuroscience.uth.tmc.edu/s2/chapter06.html

Then it seems that you will never have the medical knowledge you wished. At least you do have a specialty, wishful thinking.

I wish so many things surgen but i also reach the stage in which i believe in priorities.
I just don't wish to be reborn again and again to chase hallucinations and delay the day i will merge in the ocean of bliss.
What about you?
Are you happy to live in a world in which there is no real progress?

"No real progress" The irony is sweet. If only I typed this up 2000 years ago and sent it digitially over thousands of miles to a person I haven't even meet, oh wait, we can only do this in this age. I wonder why.

If only I had my slaves, damn human rights.

LOL. Nobody is qualified. Do you know why? Because you lie the best to yourself. Hense, you cannot trust yourself to determine what is objectively true.

In a way nobody except God is really qualify but there are some people who are a bit more qualify than other.
If you never take any risk you never get anywhere.
By the way surgen, just ask you one small question.
When you find a beautiful person and you wish to kiss him-her do you ask a medical certificate that he-she doesn't have syphilis or AIDS or you go along and kiss?

Translation: If you never try to believe in unproven claims, then you will never believe in unproven claims.
And thats the way I like it.

To answer your question, no. I would not asked for a medical certificate because syphilis and AIDs rarely spread through kissing. Plus, syphilis gives you sores that are easily spotted.

There you go again putting the cart before the horse. You first have to prove that a spirits exist before you can claim a gland is its doorway. Do you even understand the duelist problem with this hypothesis? How is a physical thing suppose to interact with a spiritual thing? There has to be a mediator, what is the mediator?

I find the evidence when i do meditation.
By concentrating on a particular gland i feel that gland as the center of energy in that particular area but again it is by practicing that you may understand this point.

Delusion 101.

I'm not even sure what you're saying here. The brain has sections that control different aspects. All these sections do work together like a giant commitee. There is noone in charge, and everyone is kind of doing their own thing. However, they still talk to each other.

You still are far far away and in the middle of the big ocean and the shore is still far far away.
But as the old granny said.............it is never too late.......

You're still a house cat in jungle of dinosaurs. But don't worry, you can still play with yarn.......it will always be there...........

See, I can also make pointless statements too. However, you have a lot more experience.

Thosands of alien abduction testimonials that come to the same conclusion are no evidence. There not evidence for aliens because there are simple psycological explanations for each case. NDE's are in the same boat.

Are you saying that the atheists that had an NDE and no longer are atheists had all an hallucination?

WOW. Just WOW. How the fuck did you jump from a talk about the validity of testmonials to atheist stop being atheist? You must really hate this topic to try to change it this badly. So.... prove that testimonials are scientific evidences.

First off, I never said they were lying. I said they were wrong. For someone to lie, they first have to know that what they're saying isn't true.
You can't seem to grasp the concept of the null hypothesis. The null hypothesis is always based on well known phenomena. The physical universe is a well known phenomena. Before you can propose newly discovered phenomena, you first have to show that the known ones cannot explain the observations. Then, you can create a falsifiable hypothesis that you test. So far, you haven't been able to do the first step. And the next step is impossible for you because your hypothesis is not falsifiable. Hense, it is not scientific.

Why don't you go to grab the ex atheists that after an NDE are now believing in God and bang them in the head until they admit that what they really had was just a big hallucination.
Go on surgen.

Oh look, you also don't like to talk about the null hypothesis either. Why not? Why are you changing the subject?

Also, can you really trust someones memory?

[Davka]

Ok. this is just an hypothetical question so keep cool and calm.
No need to get excited.
WHAT WOULD YOU THINK OR SAY IF YOU DIE AND FIND OUT THAT YOUR CONSCIOUSNESS IS STILL ALIVE AND WELL AND GOD IS THERE?

Your body is left behind to rot but your body is not you anymore.
You are there facing God.
1) Would you say.........oh, well there was no evidence that you existed that is why i never believe that you exist.
2) I was wrong in not looking at all options.
3) I never thought that by refusing to consider that you exist i could not expect that you manifest in my consciousness.

If none of these options come closer to your thinking then please express your thought.
I am curious to know what you would say to this HYPOTHETICAL God in this HYPOTHETICAL case.
Thanks.

I'd be totally cool with it.

If there is a god and she loves me and knows my heart, she'll be glad to see me.

If there is a god and he's a capricious asshole like the YHWH figure in the wholly babble, I don't want to spend the afterlife anywhere near him. Who knows what weird sadistic shit he might get up to next?

Frankly, I'd be much more surprised that my consciousness could exist after my brain stopped working than I would to discover a deity. Once you posit a disembodied afterlife, anything else is just gilding the lily.

[Little Rik]

Ok. this is just an hypothetical question so keep cool and calm.
No need to get excited.
WHAT WOULD YOU THINK OR SAY IF YOU DIE AND FIND OUT THAT YOUR CONSCIOUSNESS IS STILL ALIVE AND WELL AND GOD IS THERE?

Your body is left behind to rot but your body is not you anymore.
You are there facing God.
1) Would you say.........oh, well there was no evidence that you existed that is why i never believe that you exist.
2) I was wrong in not looking at all options.
3) I never thought that by refusing to consider that you exist i could not expect that you manifest in my consciousness.

If none of these options come closer to your thinking then please express your thought.
I am curious to know what you would say to this HYPOTHETICAL God in this HYPOTHETICAL case.
Thanks.

I'd be totally cool with it.

If there is a god and she loves me and knows my heart, she'll be glad to see me.

If there is a god and he's a capricious asshole like the YHWH figure in the wholly babble, I don't want to spend the afterlife anywhere near him. Who knows what weird sadistic shit he might get up to next?

Frankly, I'd be much more surprised that my consciousness could exist after my brain stopped working than I would to discover a deity. Once you posit a disembodied afterlife, anything else is just gilding the lily.

Ok.
Now for a minute try to think that you are God and you are dealing with an atheist that just pop up in the supernatural world after his physical death.
As an hypothetical God and as the master of the universe what would you think or do.
Would you be pleased to see him or would you be pissed off to see him.