girlish girls, manly men.

[Alex K]

No, I have an enlightened view of depression.

It should give you pause that your enlightened picture is so simplistic compared to what science says about the topic.

BTW, I had depression when I was young. I'm still susceptible to it. I did drugs every day for fifteen years. That didn't do my brain chemistry any good. I've learned how to overcome it.

I'm sorry to hear that, and it's great that it's working for you now, but others are not so lucky, and it's decidedly not because they don't have the balls like you or whatever.

and didn't present it as a silver bullet.

But then what precisely was your point bringing it up? What is the argument you were trying to make?

[John V]

No, that's not a straw man. A straw man is if I misrepresent your position and then argue against that. Please tell me where I have misrepresented your position and how.

Here:
It also doesn't mean that this is some kind of useful way out of clinical depression in any individual case, irrespective of what WebMD writes. I mean, you are trying to insinuate that these people would not have depression if they adopted your lifestyle.

I'm not making a claim regarding an individual case. You insinuate that I am.

You are trying to establish a rule that is supposed to work in the majority of cases apart from exceptions, and I'm pointing out that you do it using faulty logic, and therefore you have not presented a valid argument.

Are you seriously unaware of studies on exercise and depression? And you people say I'm ignorant! Yes, in general, exercise, eating right etc. have a positive impact on mood in depressed people.

I think you are stretching my metaphor a bit too far.

Seems reasonable to me.

[Alex K]

Are you seriously unaware of studies on exercise and depression? And you people say I'm ignorant! Yes, in general, exercise, eating right etc. have a positive impact on mood in depressed people.

Come on, that's an old hat, I am aware of those things. But why did you bring it up, what is its part in your argument concerning your idea about gender roles?

It also doesn't mean that this is some kind of useful way out of clinical depression in any individual case, irrespective of what WebMD writes.

I'm not making a claim regarding an individual case. You insinuate that I am.

Fair enough, bad wording on my part, I should have said "in the majority of individuals/as a general rule"

[John V]

It should give you pause that your enlightened picture is so simplistic compared to what science says about the topic.

That's not the case. Real men work out. Science has shown that exercise helps to fight depression. This shouldn't be controversial. Most people on this board for some reason pay lip service to scientifically proven natural methods while worshiping prescription drugs.

I'm sorry to hear that,

Don't be. I don't regret the past. I move on to the future.

and it's great that it's working for you now, but others are not so lucky,

It's not about luck.

and it's decidedly not because they don't have the balls like you or whatever.

So you don't know why they're still suffering, but you're sure that nothing I say can help them. Goit it!

But then what precisely was your point bringing it up? What is the argument you were trying to make?

As noted, that a fairly mainstream site gives ten natural ways to combat depression, and five of those things are also things a real man would do.

[Tonus]

BTW, I had depression when I was young. I'm still susceptible to it. I did drugs every day for fifteen years. That didn't do my brain chemistry any good. I've learned how to overcome it.

In a manly way?

[Whateverist]

I would imagine many xtians have to deal with depression. What is truly depressing is that their shared mindset makes that a noble thing to do. The payoff isn't expected in this life time. Like the troll here the thing to do is shoulder your cross in a manly fashion all the while whistling some xtian hymn.

Okay I'm done feeding the troll. See you all around - except trolly. You stay right here and go on putting on your troll show.

[Alex K]

It should give you pause that your enlightened picture is so simplistic compared to what science says about the topic.

That's not the case. Real men work out. Science has shown that exercise helps to fight depression. This shouldn't be controversial. Most people on this board for some reason pay lip service to scientifically proven natural methods while worshiping prescription drugs.

It may help in some cases, sure.

I'm sorry to hear that,

Don't be. I don't regret the past. I move on to the future.

and it's great that it's working for you now, but others are not so lucky,

It's not about luck.

Oh, but it is. Some obviously get hit harder than you and can't find their way out of it just with some lifestyle changes, and might get hit so hard that they don't find the strength in themselves to make them.

and it's decidedly not because they don't have the balls like you or whatever.

So you don't know why they're still suffering, but you're sure that nothing I say can help them. Goit it!

No, I'm not saying that. Especially if you've overcome some form of depression, you may have valuable insights to give. It's just that it is known that there are cases of depression where lifestyle changes do not solve the problem.

But then what precisely was your point bringing it up? What is the argument you were trying to make?

As noted, that a fairly mainstream site gives ten natural ways to combat depression, and five of those things are also things a real man would do.

Ok, noted. But that's just an observation, what are you trying to tell us with this information. The real issue here is that you are trying to tie your health advice to completely problematic ideas about relationships and gender, and you better have a good argument why that baggage should be part of the deal. In fact, you brought the whole depression thing in as a validation that your ideas about relationships are correct, because some of the people who argue against you are depressed. That's an absolute non sequitur.

I don't think anyone here is arguing against your (a bit bromideish) insight that if you're depressed, you should at least try those things such as exercise, etc.

[John V]

I would imagine many xtians have to deal with depression. What is truly depressing is that their shared mindset makes that a noble thing to do. The payoff isn't expected in this life time. Like the troll here the thing to do is shoulder your cross in a manly fashion all the while whistling some xtian hymn.

Except...I overcame it in this lifetime.

[Whateverist]

So with an ego this big, what do you need God for? Hope it will fit through that eye of the needle they talk about.

[Alex K]

So with an ego this big, what do you need God for?

My guess would be that he gets his philosophical input from Mars Hill.

http://www.amazon.com/Real-Marriage-Trut...B009F7QZHG

http://www.amazon.com/Reforming-Male-Sex...B009EGB000